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Squashing top down textures to look right in Perspectives

LoopysueLoopysue ProFantasy 🖼️ 40 images Cartographer
in Mapping with ProFantasy's Software
If you have a 120 degree ISO grid (the angle in the top and bottom parts of each grid square is 120, and the angle at either end is 60), and you want to reduce the height of a square piece of desert texture to correspond with that perspective, is it just a simple case of using trigonometry to calculate the new height to width ratio - ie how much to squash it down?

I worked it out as being:

1 unit high : 1.7321 units wide

I know it wouldn't work with forest textures or anything that has too much top down view structure in it, but I have a few fills in my library that might look ok, including this desert one:

[Image_6824]

Which I distorted by the aforementioned ratio to this:

[Image_6825]

I'd be interested in knowing what you think - whether you think I've done my maths wrong (which is more than likely!), or if you think it looks right/wrong :)
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Comments

  • MonsenMonsen Administrator 🖼️ 81 images Cartographer
    edited October 2016
    I haven't checked your math, but doing it manually or modifying your fills shouldn't be necessary, just use the 3D-Projection [IPROJ] command of Perspectives 3 on the filled polygon, and it should handle it for you (I think. Trying to figure out what I am actually seeing in perspective hurts my brain)
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  • ShessarShessar 🖼️ 34 images Mapmaker
    Monsen is correct (of course). Per3 handles the rotation of the fills. Just import them as is.

    Have I ever told anyone just how much I love Per3? LOL
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  • DogtagDogtag Moderator, Betatester Traveler
    edited October 2016
    Perspectives handles textures much like (or probably exactly like) the Shaded Polygon command handles them in CC3, only it does so automatically based on the input used to draw the entities.

    The full Shaded Polygon command is a little more complex than it's easier-to-use cousin, the Shaded Polygon (Angle by Edge) command that I explained in my video tutorial. The full command can align/rotate the fill to any angle, not just to the lower edge of the pitch. In fact, I believe you can draw anything in the main CC3 program that you can do in the Perspectives add-on. Perspectives just packages several commands, functions, and features into tools that are much easier and less time consuming.
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  • MonsenMonsen Administrator 🖼️ 81 images Cartographer
    edited October 2016
    Yes, this is true, but only because CC3+ should still be able to view the files without Per3 installed (not including raster artwork), you may remember that there was a small update to CC3+ prior to the release of Perspectives, to provide support for this. However, you have to go a bit further than just the full Shaded Polygon command, because you need to edit several flags which controls how CC3+ handles these entities, because we are not just talking simple rotations here. This can be done with the EDITSHADING command (Warning, this isn't really meant to be used by the end user, it is more a testing/debugging tool) on an already shaded entity.
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  • DogtagDogtag Moderator, Betatester Traveler
    If you want to make isometric maps, Perspectives 3 is definitely the way to go. Unless, maybe, if you're Joachim de Ravenbel, who seems able to do the calculations in his sleep. :-D
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  • LoopysueLoopysue ProFantasy 🖼️ 40 images Cartographer
    edited October 2016
    Posted By: MonsenI haven't checked your math, but doing it manually or modifying your fills shouldn't be necessary, just use the 3D-Projection [IPROJ] command of Perspectives 3 on the filled polygon, and it should handle it for you (I think. Trying to figure out what I am actually seeing in perspective hurts my brain)
    To be honest ISO perspective hurts my brain as well. I'm used to seeing things in true perspective, and that has lots of vanishing points and curves in it ;)

    I didn't know (and still don't know) what perspectives has in it, because I won't have enough broadband to download the software until midnight tonight when I go onto my new contract, but thanks for telling me my worries are all fairly needless. Its actually a relief to not have to worry about making a specially adjusted set of fills :)
    Posted By: ShessarMonsen is correct (of course). Per3 handles the rotation of the fills. Just import them as is.

    Have I ever told anyone just how much I love Per3? LOL
    No... but you have now :)

    Nice to hear from you Shessar - hope the op went well :)
    Posted By: DogtagPerspectives handles textures much like (or probably exactly like) theShaded Polygoncommand handles them in CC3, only it does so automatically based on the input used to draw the entities.

    The fullShaded Polygoncommand is a little more complex than it's easier-to-use cousin, theShaded Polygon (Angle by Edge)command that I explained in myvideo tutorial. The full command can align/rotate the fill toanyangle, not just to the lower edge of the pitch. In fact, I believe you can draw anything in the main CC3 program that you can do in the Perspectives add-on. Perspectives just packages several commands, functions, and features into tools that aremucheasier and less time consuming.
    Thanks Dogtag. I remember that video - an excellent teaching tool :)

    I wouldn't have been able to figure out the temple in my Merelan City map without it.

    Even while I've been typing this comment I think I may still need to worry about squishing a few fills to be automatically the right squashedness, because I'm hoping to create a new symbol set - modern city buildings, and I wouldn't want them to spring back into non-ISO dimensions if the symbols I make are imported into a CC3 template to go with... I don't know... maybe an HW landscape? Mind you I may just be a bit muddled up right at the moment because a) I haven't even got the software yet to understand it all properly, and b) I've just come back from a very circular 4 hour conversation with my completely adorable (but slightly scatty) mother, and my brain is still lying stretched out somewhere on a sun drenched jungle bough like a lazy old cat.
    Posted By: MonsenYes, this is true, but only because CC3+ should still be able to view the files without Per3 installed (not including raster artwork), you may remember that there was a small update to CC3+ prior to the release of Perspectives, to provide support for this. However, you have to go a bit further than just the full Shaded Polygon command, because you need to edit several flags which controls how CC3+ handles these entities, because we are not just talking simple rotations here. This can be done with the EDITSHADING command (Warning, this isn't really meant to be used by the end user, it is more a testing/debugging tool) on an already shaded entity.
    Errr... I'm afraid that just went straight over my head, Remy - probably due to reason b) above ;)

    I'll come back and read it again later when I've cooled down a bit from my mother's greenhouse-hot place, and woken up just a little bit more.
    Posted By: DogtagIf you want to make isometric maps, Perspectives 3 is definitely the way to go. Unless, maybe, if you're Joachim de Ravenbel, who seems able to do the calculations in his sleep.:-D
    Oh I quite agree with you on that point. There's just no way I can imagine things in ISO (when doing so gives me a brain ache) without having at the very least an ISO grid to snap all my very straight modern city blocks to ;)

    Don't think I've had the pleasure of meeting Joachim de Ravenbel. Not seen any of his work either.

    I bet your going to tell me he invented something, or created something really cool :)
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  • MonsenMonsen Administrator 🖼️ 81 images Cartographer
    Posted By: LoopysueI wouldn't want them to spring back into non-ISO dimensions if the symbols I make are imported into a CC3 template
    Don't worry, that won't happen (At least as long as the CC3+ instance is up to date). These are properties on the entity itself, doesn't have anything to do with the template used.
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  • LoopysueLoopysue ProFantasy 🖼️ 40 images Cartographer
    Thanks Remy :)

    I apologise in advance for all the really stupid questions I'm probably going to ask in the process of doing this particular project - though I'm hoping most of the answers will be in the Tome ;) LOL
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  • GatharGathar Traveler
    Hello Sue,

    If you haven't seen Joachim maps yet, I really suggest you go to his web site as soon as you have better internet access. For instance, his perspective tower of desert winds is gorgeous...
    He also has a very instructive tutorial on 3D drawing. His web site is http://jdr68.jimdo.com/
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  • LoopysueLoopysue ProFantasy 🖼️ 40 images Cartographer
    Arrrgh! The torment!!!

    2 hours to go!!!

    ROFL!

    Thanks Gathar. I will!
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  • DogtagDogtag Moderator, Betatester Traveler
    Posted By: GatharHello Sue,

    If you haven't seen Joachim maps yet, I really suggest you go to his web site as soon as you have better internet access.
    Also, I pointed to some of his work in your Ethran: Merelan City topic. Apparently, he's chained to a dungeon wall, working for ProFantasy to update their Temples, Tombs, and Catacombs Source Maps supplement. Okay, maybe not "chained to a wall," but hard at work.
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  • LoopysueLoopysue ProFantasy 🖼️ 40 images Cartographer
    That's where I've heard his name before!

    You know me - memory of a goldfish!

    30 minutes to go...
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