I know that would be the case, but they are really symbols, not meant to be in scale with reality. Bigger does mean we can see them better against the hill background. Mind you, I am prone to smallish symbols myself, and Remy and Ralf are gradually talking me out of them (though they don't know it)
The 2.5 version is an improvement Jim, but it's still too "busy" to my eye, making it hard to pick out what's important and what's hill-background "noise". Problem of seeing that Magic Eye confusion thing is not being able to unsee it, I suspect...
I'm starting to wonder if going for something much more radical might work - say removing all except the few larger or more important landmark hills, and using just a suitably-coloured "hill" background poly (the Mike Schley style has a lightly textured "Hills Background" bitmap fill, certainly) to show the entire map is set among hills. Or perhaps, as I think from the patterning you've used the Mike Schley "Hills" bitmap fill already, you could use an Effect to tone it down - something like Transparency, say - leaving the important hills as individual symbols on a different Sheet so they'll still stand out nicely.
Nope, I don't have such a fill on the map. I also don't see what you all mean by the 'Magic Eye' effect. To me, Magic Eye is an early form of voice levels on a reel to reel tape recorder.
I just checked, the hills are scale 6, and the trees are scale 3. Map original scale is 1.0.
I made it again, using different symbols in different places. I tried to vary them as I placed which ones where. The ones 'in back' are scale 3.0, the ones 'in front' are scale 6.0. The map is 3000 across, so 3.0 is the default.
Somehow I got some of the symbols, buildings, tents, etc. on the wrong sheet so they are going behind the hills. When I get that fixed I'll add more stuff.
The placement of your scale bar and compass rose do make thing look a bit messy though. Unless there is very good reasons for it (i.e. important details you don't want to cover up), it looks much cleaner when they are tucked away in a corner, either in two separate corners, or the scalebar in the bottom left ot right corner, with the compass rose right above it, aligned against the edge of the map.
No symbols for the Giants' Garden. Love the sizing of everything else though, as well as current positioning of compass and scale. Perhaps make the title a wee bit larger than the rest of the text?
Okay, test run. Text and maps. I have a bit of time, and it beats starring at the clock.
The Gathering Place and The MIthlas Holes Environs.
the_mithlas_holes_area.fcw
The Gathering Place. Nomadic tents of elves. They tell anyone who sees them, they are merchants. They might even sell you something. Or say they are on their way to buy more goods and are currently out.
Their real reason is to head, not bunched up nor all at once but to eventually all arrive in the same week, to The Gathering Place. A ruined tower, all that is left of what they believe was once a might elf city.
There aren't enough ruins to justify such a claim, but they just 'know' that the stones that were there were carried off by evil forces to build something Evil. This could even be true. This has been passed down to them and their relatives. Is it true ? Well, they have found traces of foundations a mile away from this tower. And sometimes late at night they been awakened by a distant elf flute playing mournfully. Those that seek where the sound comes from, are never heard from again.
The Mithlas Holes Entrance Area
the_mithlas_holes_hillentrance.fcw
Ebereth is just off to the Northeast. A small thriving community. Years ago some folks went to The Mithlas Holes to see why they hadn't been to town. The survivors of this trip said no one lived there anymore.
Giants' Garden. A supposed area where giant's once grew food. The occasional ear of corn brought to town are usually ignored. Corn on the cob cannot grow to be as big as a house.
Elf Encampment. A group of elves who travel about this area, keeping a distant eye on Mithlas Holes.
The Mithlas Holes. A series of rooms that once had a thriving community of elves.
I'll post more as I go through the maps and the text.
various broken up rocks. Dead trees. Two felled trees. An abandoned and falling down keep. All surround the entrance to these caves.
Someone has been cutting trees down.
TMH_ruins_ground_floor.fcw
room 1) 30' x 60' x 10' Original use, unknown. Three straw pallets, with pillows. Two chests. Not made by elves.
room 2) 30' x 60' x 12' empty of all but dust.
room 3) 40' x 30' x 10' guard ready room.
room 4) 30' x 50' x 10' guard barracks
room 5) 40' x 30' x 10' spiral stairs down to basement. Last stand by one elf, behind 4 barrels.
room 6) 40' x 30' x 15' Might have been a room for an elf leader. The two pits are crude and veery likely added later.
room 7) 40' x 40' x 20' Two chairs, a rug, and a fireplace. The table and the items on it are an illusion. A candle stand and a bowl of fruit.
room 8) 50' x 30' x 10' west door is gone. Three piles of wood debris, and a fireplace. Could have been a one person room at one time in the past.
room 9) 110' x 50' x 15' Entrance area. Looks like a last stand happened here.
Spike barriers, skeletons, wood debris, 6 barrels. The secret door, push on the left side.
Stone door on west side leads to the guard ready room.
There is a 10' gap of stone between the tunnel that goes under the entrance tunnel.
room 9A) 30' x 20' x 10' 3 skeletons, and opened chest
room 9B) 30' x 20' x 10' 3 skeletons
room 10) and room 10C) is the kitchen.
room 10A) Someone moved one of the portable pantries not realizing they were blocking a secret door. Push on the right side of the secret door to open it.
room 10B) dining area.
room 11) dining area. No dust, but the tables look nice.
room 12) 20' x 70' x 10' storage for the former alleged lord.
room 12A) 20' x 20' x 10' bedroom. Bed, rug, and a side table, with a lit candle on it.
room 12B) 20' x 20' x 10' bedroom. Bed, rug, and a side table, with a lit candle on it.
room 13) 50' x 50' x 30' former almost throne room. A throne, and 3 smaller cushioned chairs. A large chest and 2 dmaller chests. Don't look like they have ever been opened. No dust on them, but there is dust on everything else.
The chariot was made by demand, but assembled here. too big to get out of the room. It has traces of gold on it.
A campfire and a basket near the south wall.
room 14) 50' x 30' x 12' straw covered floor. Crunchy underfoot. Three chairs with blue seat cushions. And open chest and wood debris. The wood entrance doors look broken.
room 15) cave, approximately 145' x 70' x 30' drinking water. When they caught the would be Lord bathing in their drinking water, they kicked him out.
Wood chest in the water.
room 16) 20' x 60' x 10' store room. Wood debris. Faint smell of various foods.
room 17) 30' x 10' x 10' secret passageway, one skeleton.
room 18) 40' x 10' x 10' quick passage for the ready guards to defend the entrance.
@JimP Looking at these now, and I am wondering a bit on the scale of the the_mithlas_holes_hillentrance.FCW map. The entire map is 3000 x 2200 feet. Converted to miles, that's 0.57 x 0.42 miles. That means that the region on the parent map (the_mithlas_holes_area.FCW) it describes is utterly minuscule, and wouldn't really fit both giant's garden and the mithas holes entrance on the same map. See the solid colored pink rectangle in the image below for the actual area covered here.
The map itself is fine as it is, so my suggestion is just to scale the entire map by a factor of 10, making it cover 30000 by 22000 feet instead (Suggested size shown by the hollow pink rectangle in the image), or whatever you find appropriate. Just remember to actually scale the entire map by the chosen amount, and not just edit the number on the scalebar.
Scalebar on the_mithlas_holes_entrance.FCW also reads "Scale in Miles". I am assuming this is feet?
Comments
I also think the symbols could be bigger. Say x2
I tried that yesterday. The trees and keeps were bigger than the hills.
Edit. I'm half asleep. I'll try it later today.
I know that would be the case, but they are really symbols, not meant to be in scale with reality. Bigger does mean we can see them better against the hill background. Mind you, I am prone to smallish symbols myself, and Remy and Ralf are gradually talking me out of them (though they don't know it)
The 2.5 version is an improvement Jim, but it's still too "busy" to my eye, making it hard to pick out what's important and what's hill-background "noise". Problem of seeing that Magic Eye confusion thing is not being able to unsee it, I suspect...
I'm starting to wonder if going for something much more radical might work - say removing all except the few larger or more important landmark hills, and using just a suitably-coloured "hill" background poly (the Mike Schley style has a lightly textured "Hills Background" bitmap fill, certainly) to show the entire map is set among hills. Or perhaps, as I think from the patterning you've used the Mike Schley "Hills" bitmap fill already, you could use an Effect to tone it down - something like Transparency, say - leaving the important hills as individual symbols on a different Sheet so they'll still stand out nicely.
Nope, I don't have such a fill on the map. I also don't see what you all mean by the 'Magic Eye' effect. To me, Magic Eye is an early form of voice levels on a reel to reel tape recorder.
I just checked, the hills are scale 6, and the trees are scale 3. Map original scale is 1.0.
Must just be repeating hill symbols looking like that Mike Schley hills fill. I didn't spend a lot of time making detailed comparisons!
Sorry if the Magic Eye visual thing has you flummoxed. They're these books (Wikipedia link).
I did use the same symbols repeatedly. I can vary them later today and post that.
The Giants' Garden was meant to make very large planting rows, but I can see about varying the rest.
I made it again, using different symbols in different places. I tried to vary them as I placed which ones where. The ones 'in back' are scale 3.0, the ones 'in front' are scale 6.0. The map is 3000 across, so 3.0 is the default.
900 pixel jpg, 2000 in gallery.
I like the more perspective look Jim - well done. I must make sure i do similar in my next regional maps.
Are there more site symbols and text to come.
Yes, I just wanted to show the new hills and location of the dungeon.
Somehow I got some of the symbols, buildings, tents, etc. on the wrong sheet so they are going behind the hills. When I get that fixed I'll add more stuff.
I think I have them straightened out.
900 pixel jpg, 2000 in gallery.
Much better.
The placement of your scale bar and compass rose do make thing look a bit messy though. Unless there is very good reasons for it (i.e. important details you don't want to cover up), it looks much cleaner when they are tucked away in a corner, either in two separate corners, or the scalebar in the bottom left ot right corner, with the compass rose right above it, aligned against the edge of the map.
Map also needs a nice map title displayed on it.
I didn't want to cover up the elf encampment and trees. I'll look at it some more.
Yup,not finished.
I didn't want to cover up the elf encampment and trees. I'll look at it some more.
You have plenty of space int he bottom right though.
Which is where I put them, before reading this. So, are we twins then ? :-)
And I finally got all hills on Symbols sheet. Somehow some wandered over to text sheet.
900 pixel jpg, 2000 in gallery.
No symbols for the Giants' Garden. Love the sizing of everything else though, as well as current positioning of compass and scale. Perhaps make the title a wee bit larger than the rest of the text?
It is a bit larger, but I can make it larger.
Giants' Garden is more a tall tale to explain the occasional house sized ears of corn that can be found there.
edit: the text was size 45, with the title being 55. I have increased the title to 65.
900 pixel jpg, 2000 in gallery.
Okay, ground floor next, then basement, and sub-basement
If no suggestions, I'll be submitting text and fcw files in a zip next week.
900 pixel jpg, the 2000 are in the gallery from before. I just wanted to post these in sequence.
basement. The spiral staircase from ground lets into the short passageway leading into room 1 of the basement.
sub-basement.
I don't see any objections, but this is the weekend. So I'll wait another day or two before I submit fcws, etc.
Tired today, dental surgery tomorrow. So, maybe Thursday or Friday I'll submit.
Okay, test run. Text and maps. I have a bit of time, and it beats starring at the clock.
The Gathering Place and The MIthlas Holes Environs.
the_mithlas_holes_area.fcw
The Gathering Place. Nomadic tents of elves. They tell anyone who sees them, they are merchants. They might even sell you something. Or say they are on their way to buy more goods and are currently out.
Their real reason is to head, not bunched up nor all at once but to eventually all arrive in the same week, to The Gathering Place. A ruined tower, all that is left of what they believe was once a might elf city.
There aren't enough ruins to justify such a claim, but they just 'know' that the stones that were there were carried off by evil forces to build something Evil. This could even be true. This has been passed down to them and their relatives. Is it true ? Well, they have found traces of foundations a mile away from this tower. And sometimes late at night they been awakened by a distant elf flute playing mournfully. Those that seek where the sound comes from, are never heard from again.
The Mithlas Holes Entrance Area
the_mithlas_holes_hillentrance.fcw
Ebereth is just off to the Northeast. A small thriving community. Years ago some folks went to The Mithlas Holes to see why they hadn't been to town. The survivors of this trip said no one lived there anymore.
Giants' Garden. A supposed area where giant's once grew food. The occasional ear of corn brought to town are usually ignored. Corn on the cob cannot grow to be as big as a house.
Elf Encampment. A group of elves who travel about this area, keeping a distant eye on Mithlas Holes.
The Mithlas Holes. A series of rooms that once had a thriving community of elves.
I'll post more as I go through the maps and the text.
The Mithlas Holes Entrance
the_mithlas_holes_entrance.fcw
various broken up rocks. Dead trees. Two felled trees. An abandoned and falling down keep. All surround the entrance to these caves.
Someone has been cutting trees down.
TMH_ruins_ground_floor.fcw
room 1) 30' x 60' x 10' Original use, unknown. Three straw pallets, with pillows. Two chests. Not made by elves.
room 2) 30' x 60' x 12' empty of all but dust.
room 3) 40' x 30' x 10' guard ready room.
room 4) 30' x 50' x 10' guard barracks
room 5) 40' x 30' x 10' spiral stairs down to basement. Last stand by one elf, behind 4 barrels.
room 6) 40' x 30' x 15' Might have been a room for an elf leader. The two pits are crude and veery likely added later.
room 7) 40' x 40' x 20' Two chairs, a rug, and a fireplace. The table and the items on it are an illusion. A candle stand and a bowl of fruit.
room 8) 50' x 30' x 10' west door is gone. Three piles of wood debris, and a fireplace. Could have been a one person room at one time in the past.
room 9) 110' x 50' x 15' Entrance area. Looks like a last stand happened here.
Spike barriers, skeletons, wood debris, 6 barrels. The secret door, push on the left side.
Stone door on west side leads to the guard ready room.
There is a 10' gap of stone between the tunnel that goes under the entrance tunnel.
room 9A) 30' x 20' x 10' 3 skeletons, and opened chest
room 9B) 30' x 20' x 10' 3 skeletons
room 10) and room 10C) is the kitchen.
room 10A) Someone moved one of the portable pantries not realizing they were blocking a secret door. Push on the right side of the secret door to open it.
room 10B) dining area.
room 11) dining area. No dust, but the tables look nice.
room 12) 20' x 70' x 10' storage for the former alleged lord.
room 12A) 20' x 20' x 10' bedroom. Bed, rug, and a side table, with a lit candle on it.
room 12B) 20' x 20' x 10' bedroom. Bed, rug, and a side table, with a lit candle on it.
room 13) 50' x 50' x 30' former almost throne room. A throne, and 3 smaller cushioned chairs. A large chest and 2 dmaller chests. Don't look like they have ever been opened. No dust on them, but there is dust on everything else.
The chariot was made by demand, but assembled here. too big to get out of the room. It has traces of gold on it.
A campfire and a basket near the south wall.
room 14) 50' x 30' x 12' straw covered floor. Crunchy underfoot. Three chairs with blue seat cushions. And open chest and wood debris. The wood entrance doors look broken.
room 15) cave, approximately 145' x 70' x 30' drinking water. When they caught the would be Lord bathing in their drinking water, they kicked him out.
Wood chest in the water.
room 16) 20' x 60' x 10' store room. Wood debris. Faint smell of various foods.
room 17) 30' x 10' x 10' secret passageway, one skeleton.
room 18) 40' x 10' x 10' quick passage for the ready guards to defend the entrance.
the_mithlas_holes_basement.fcw
room 1) 50' x 30' x 10' A smoke filled cage. An obvious pit with spikes. Appears to have been added to the original construction.
Three chairs with their backs to the pit. The nice rug and fireplace bekons visitors to sit.
Crate by the north wall.
Lantern on the west wall. Fresh oil in it.
room 2) 50' x 30' x 10' A fountain with something growing on it. A table and chairs with a candle set on the table.
A barrel and a chest.
Passageway between room 2 and rooms 3 and 6 has some wood debris in it.
room 3) a 2' wide passage leads into this room. 10' x 10' x 8'
A skeleton and some wood debris.
room 4) 30' x 30' x 10' A minotaur head and a goblin head attached to the Northwest wall.
A skeleton in front of a set of wood drawers.
A bone and skull pillar on the east side.
An obvious pit in the Northeast corner.
room 5) 30' x 29' x 10' Two ornate pillars. A green statue that is clean and slightly polished.
A skeleton and wood debris.
room 6) 30' x 30' x 12'
A pond with a wooden crate floating on the water.
room 7) 33' x 30' x 10' spiral stairs goes down to the sub-basement.
wood debris.
A plate mail gauntlet.
And a sickle.
the_mithlas_holes_sub_basement.fcw
from time to time, a distant sound of painful moans and/or low screams of pain can be heard. No source can be found.
room 1) 60' circle, 10' high.
Spiral stair case going up.
wood debris.
Two skeletons under some rocks block access to the secret door. To open, push on the right side.
room 2) 29' x 36' x 9'
Wooden pallisades blocking access to the partially dug passageway.
room 3) 56' x 47' x 10'
wood barricades. Three stacks of lumber. A table with 3 skeletons nearby.
room 4) 28' x 36' x 10' A cloth partition didn't save them.
an open chest.
room 5) Two folded barricades and 3 open and empty barrels.
room 6) 31' x 38' x 7'
Two skeletons behind 5 mining carts.
Wood debris. Two loose floor stones.
room 7) 27' x 35' x 10'
Stone debris, but the ceiling is smooth rock.
Wood debris with fungi growing on it.
room 8) 47' x 38' x 10'
A dragon head trophy on the wall.
Cloth partition.
Two chest of drawers, empty of clothing, only dust.
room 9) 27' x 27' x 10'
Lots of wood debris, broken tables.
Chest at the bottom of a pit.
room 10) 28' x 36' x 7' Treasure room.
2 chests.
a barrel.
two tables with a roll of blue silk on them.
an unlit brazier
skeleton who might have been a guard.
room 11) 38' x 45' x 10'
Three red painted chairs facing a bubbling cauldron with some sort of green liquid in it.
Three bookshelves in the room.
A campfire, cold, apparently not used for some time.
room 12) 48' x 36' x 10'
A mine cart on part of a mine railway.
The two chests cannot be reached due some sort of field in the inside of the area covered by the mine tracks.
room 13) 30' x 27' x 10'
A blue shield with a painting of a dolphin on it. Glows slightly.
Chest.
an old campfire ring.
room 14) 47' x 27' x 9'
empty, no dust.
Secret door, push on the left side to open.
room 15) 54' x 46' x 10'
Three carts behind the cloth partition.
A bubbling mud pot... Could there be a volcano under this dungeon ?
( it is a location of mud bubbling due to heat rising up from below. )
room 16) 28' x 36' x 7'
A red comfy chair in the room.
room 17) 34' circle x 10' high
wood debris
A skeleton
Two sets of human footprints
Two cold campfires.
Two portcullis iron pegged to the stone floor.
That is it.
Not working on maps for a couple of days. Two extractions.
Hope all goes well Jim. Not pleasant...
I feel better, but I'm still taking it easy. Thanks.
I almost forgot to match the text and map filenames... 485kb. Inside each of the 6 text files, it names the map file that goes with it.
@Monsen
I removed the zip and will upload the updated version when I fix the map mentioned. Jim
@JimP Looking at these now, and I am wondering a bit on the scale of the the_mithlas_holes_hillentrance.FCW map. The entire map is 3000 x 2200 feet. Converted to miles, that's 0.57 x 0.42 miles. That means that the region on the parent map (the_mithlas_holes_area.FCW) it describes is utterly minuscule, and wouldn't really fit both giant's garden and the mithas holes entrance on the same map. See the solid colored pink rectangle in the image below for the actual area covered here.
The map itself is fine as it is, so my suggestion is just to scale the entire map by a factor of 10, making it cover 30000 by 22000 feet instead (Suggested size shown by the hollow pink rectangle in the image), or whatever you find appropriate. Just remember to actually scale the entire map by the chosen amount, and not just edit the number on the scalebar.
Scalebar on the_mithlas_holes_entrance.FCW also reads "Scale in Miles". I am assuming this is feet?
That is what I get for working on this in the days after dental surgery. I'll work.on it. But likely not until Sunday afternoon or Monday.
I'll try your suggestions.