Annual 8 (2014): Styles insist on using wrong symbol set

Barliman

Hi all,

So, I recently bought the 2014 Annual when I learned it was converted for use with CC3+. Installation went without an apparent hitch. But, when I started to playing with the "Worthington Historical" style, I noticed that pressing one of the button to change symbols (for example, to get the Structures symbols), the symbols that came up were for the CC3 "Standard Overland" style. This was true no matter which button I pressed. The same happened in the "Modern Journeys" style. If I close CC3+ and reopen it, the right symbols are there, but I get "Standard Overland" as soon as I press a symbol button. I haven't tested other styles, yet.

Any ideas what's going on here? (insert head-scratching smiley)

cobra mustang

I asked question on the boards the other day about CC3 and CC3+ and if there was an advantage of having both installed. One of the great users here said that some old annuals and such worked much better with CC3 rather than with +.

Barliman

Posted By: cobra mustangI asked question on the boards the other day about CC3 and CC3+ and if there was an advantage of having both installed. One of the great users here said that some old annuals and such worked much better with CC3 rather than with +.

True, but this one was supposed to be CC3+ compatible. I suspect a glitch in the conversion, or something I'm ding wrong. (And I never rule that out! )

Dogtag

I looked at my original CC3 version and the same thing happens there, too. It appears there's only one symbol catalog for the style, CA91Symbols.FSC. This is essentially the Structures (and Cartouches) catalog that opens with the map. The mapping guide seems to confirm that the only symbols for the style are the Structures and Cartouches. Everything else is done via textures and drawing tools.

I agree it would be less confusing if the symbol buttons just kept opening the same catalog rather than changing to the defaults, but there aren't any other catalogs for this style.

Cheers,
~Dogtag

CharlesWayneRobinson

When did the 2014 Annual get updated? I do not see anything about it on the blog or forum?

Lorelei

I just realized this myself last week (I read something about it in a post) and downloaded it right away!!! Now....just five more years to backlog!!!!! I have been using CC3+ more recently, only because of how fast it is and the ability to save larger files without it crashing....but that is the ONLY reason i use CC3+. I LOVE my Annuals in my CC3 program. LOVE. I'm pretty sure i've said that a few times in a few posts. LOVE the back Annuals.

Barliman

Posted By: DogtagI looked at my original CC3 version and the same thing happens there, too. It appears there's only one symbol catalog for the style,CA91Symbols.FSC. This is essentially the Structures (and Cartouches) catalog that opens with the map. The mapping guide seems to confirm that the only symbols for the style are the Structures and Cartouches. Everything else is done via textures and drawing tools.

I agree it would be less confusing if the symbol buttons just kept opening the same catalog rather than changing to the defaults, but there aren't any other catalogs for this style.

Cheers,
~Dogtag

Ah, I guess I should have read the guide, first, before rushing in to play.

Still one would think that pressing the structures button would stay on the appropriate catalog, not switch to the default.

Dogtag

Posted By: CharlesWayneRobinsonWhen did the 2014 Annual get updated? I do not see anything about it on the blog or forum?

Yeah, I honestly don't remember how I learned about it. I thought I read it in a comment somewhere on the forum but I might've just accidentally discovered it when downloading a recent issue of this year's annual.

JimP

I just looked at my account... I noticed that if the Annual shows 2 files listed, it isn't updated. If it shows 3, like the 2014 does, it has been updated. Note folks that I have everything a patron license and so I have all the software.

Dogtag

To be fair, most past annuals include the setup file and a descriptive PDF but the 2015 annual (volume 9) does not include a descriptive PDF, so it shows only two files even though it's converted for CC3+. It is the exception, however.

zaleksf

My hope is to soon see the 2013 Annual (#7) converted to CC3+.

I would gladly support a delay/replacement of one or more new monthly installments in order to provide the time necessary to convert previous annual collections.

Dogtag

It'd be great if we could get them all real soon. I completely echo Lorelei's sentiment that I love the annuals.

Unfortunately, it's going to take time, and I suspect we won't see anything along those lines before Ralf returns from walking the Earth like Caine. In fact, it's more likely it'll be at least some time after that, since I'd wager my subscription he's not doing much work on this stuff while he's out enjoying Life down under.

Ultra-deadly fauna and earthquakes notwithstanding, of course.

Barliman

Posted By: zaleksfMy hope is to soon see the 2013 Annual (#7) converted to CC3+.

I would gladly support a delay/replacement of one or more new monthly installments in order to provide the time necessary to convert previous annual collections.

For myself, I'm anxious for Annual 1. I want to play with those Mercator and Sarah Wroot styles.

I also wish I had more time to make maps.

Monsen

I love the Mercator style. It is one of my absolute favorites.

Tonnichiwa

Personally I want to see them do Issue # 66. Herwin Weilink's Isometric Dungeons. I think they would go really well with the new perspectives and the Temple of Bones issue. But because they are cc3 only right now, I cannot combine them.

JimP

Have you tried makiong the iso dungeon in CC3, the loading it into CC3+ for final work ?

I haven't done it with this particular annual, but I have done it with overland maps.

I do suggest trying a copy of the map in case there are problems.

Monsen

Posted By: JimPHave you tried makiong the iso dungeon in CC3, the loading it into CC3+ for final work ?

Won't work unfortunately, because the dungeon is built from symbols, not available in CC3+

JimP

Okay... uhm.

The below png was made in CC3, and then imported into CC3+. I then loaded the CC3+ Perspectives cave symbols and added the two stalagtites down by room number 26. So, you just cannot go back to CC3 to add more floors.

Dogtag

Yes, but I'm pretty sure Monsen meant you can't open or import the CC3 map file without losing the symbols. You can only import an image.

Monsen

Yea, sure, if you just wish to have it as a background image in CC3+ and put things on top of it, but it cannot be reworked in any way, you cannot take advantage of CC3+'s better effects, or add anything that would be sandwiched between floors. What you can do is very limited in this case.

Man, people are ninja'ing me today.

JimP

I loaded the fcw file into CC3+, its not an image, and added the two symbols.

You cannot go back to CC3 as the Persepctives symbols don't exist in CC3.

Well, you could copy the Prespectives symbol folder over, but I haven't tried that yet. So I don't know if it works.

Edit: I copied the fcw file into my CC3+ folders, then loaded it into CC3+.

JimP

The symbols are in the map. And I am moving them around in CC3+. And I have manipulated some of the symbols in this map, in CC3+. Not exactly where i wanted to place them, but I did move them and add one in. And deleted the path into room 26.

Monsen

Then you must have added the symbols to your CC3+ installation. The symbols in this particular annual are raster symbols, which means they require the external images to be present. All ProFantasy symbol catalog references the relative Symbols directory, which means that any map opened in CC3 will use the symbols directory belonging to CC3, and any map opened in CC3+ will look for the images in CC3+'s symbol directory. Copying the map file to the CC3+ directory doesn't change this.

For the record, I did try this, just to make sure the perspective installer hadn't added the symbols or something, but if I create a CA66 map in CC3, and loads it in CC3+, all I get is a bunch of red X'es. (As expected)

- Can you check your CC3+ data directory for me, and look for the Symbols\Dungeons\Annual Isometric Dungeons folder. Do you have this?
- Also, try loading my attached map into CC3+

JimP

Well, looks like I did copy the symbols over. I had forgotten. My apologies.

Monsen

No worries, I forget stuff all the time. I just needed to make sure I hadn't done any mistakes myself.

For anyone else reading this, that is a very quick and simple way getting CC3 maps using annuals into CC3+, just copy the directory with the symbols from the CC3 installation directory, to the same relative path within the CC3+ data directory. This doesn't add all tools and such, but it allows you to do post-work in CC3+ as JimP suggests here because placed symbols will turn up in the map. (You may need to copy some fill style files from the Bitmaps directory as well, depending on the map)