Vector vs PNG Symbols?

Repeater07

Okay,

While I love the "glossy" and photoshop look of the png symbols, I am more old school when creating my maps stick with vector symbols. I doubt I will ever use the png symbols when I can create a vector symbol out of the image.

Does anyone have any gottas or recommendations in CC3 I should keep in mind? I created a lot of symbols for CC2 and want to ensure that will work well in CC3. So anything I should keep in mind?

Like keeping the symbol on a specific sheet or layer? Or not using outline2? Or in CC2 you need to watch your number of polys or the outline would not sure up.

jaerdaph

Let me see if I can start you off on your quest.

You can definitely use any older vector symbol catalogs you have from your CC2 days in CC3. To convert them to CC3, do the following:

1) Open up the CC2 vector symbol catalog (FCT file) you want to convert in CC3 (File Menu -> Open)
2) Open Symbol Manager (Symbols -> Symbol Manager...)
3) Once in Symbol Manager, hit the shift key and while still depressing it click the first symbol in the catalog, scroll down and click the last symbol - this selects all of the symbols in the catalog (so now you can stop depressing the Shift key)
4) Click the Options button - check the box that says "Force Symbols" under General Options, then type in the name of a sheet to force the symbols to - the default is SYMBOLS*. This makes it so that any time you select a symbol from the catalog, it will automatically go on the SYMBOLS sheet. Yes, you do want to include the * at the end of the sheet name, just in case you ever have additional sheet names that start with SYMBOLS (e.g. SYMBOLS2). If you change the sheet to SYMBOLS2 then select the symbol to place, it will put the symbol on the SYMBOLS2 sheet rather than the default SYMBOLS.
5) Click OK, click OK again, and then save the catalog.

Other things to remember: In CC3, sheets have a new role than they did in CC2, and you have to keep them in mind (unlike CC2, where you could just ignore them). Think of sheets as "layers" now (i.e., they are stacked), and Layers as "categories". You can apply special Sheet Effects to symbols and other entities if they are set on a sheet, even with vector symbols. Even if you only want to vector style maps with no sheet effects, you should familiarize yourself with how sheets and layers work and how they differ in CC3.

jaerdaph

CC3 Sheets: http://www.profantasy.com/cchelp/cc3_reference/layers_and_sheets/hlp_cnc_sheets.htm What's New in CC3: http://www.profantasy.com/cchelp/start_here/what_s_new_in_pro.htm

Simon Rogers

PNG symbols is only a fraction of what makes CC3 different; the effects when combined with either vector or PNG symbols are what makes the most difference. Vector symbols still have the advantage of speed, compactness and portability they always did.

When you first design your symbols, you should always bear effects in mind, and test them combined with effects on a particular sheet. Always put your symbols on that sheet (generally SYMBOLS)

Examples of vector styles:
http://sub.profantasy.com/2007/april07.html
http://sub.profantasy.com/2007/september07.html
http://sub.profantasy.com/2007/august07.html
http://sub.profantasy.com/2008/january08.html
http://sub.profantasy.com/2008/august08.html
http://sub.profantasy.com/2009/january09.html
http://sub.profantasy.com/2009/may09.html

Repeater07

Thanks for the links and help sections. I have an understanding of layers vs sheets and the new features of CC3 vs CC2. I have all the annuals, and I admit I need to study them more and I am not using many of the new features of CC3 yet, but I am more looking for any symbol creation gottas or the "you really should use this feature/effect".

In CC2, I would use outline2 so the symbol has an outline around it when it is selected and it would go on the Symbol definition layer. In CC3, I place the symbol on the SYMBOLS sheet, but is that it? I will be playing around with it, but was looking for any points from someone that has made the leap for CC2 to CC3 symbol creation.

Maybe I am making more of this then there is?

For example, I just created a vector computer console symbol. It has a lot of buttons and switches but is basically a set of shapes with outlines. Are there any effects I should be sure to test? Are there some that impact symbols more?

Simon Rogers

Taking your vector console symbol. I'll assume you've got a catalog of CC2 compatible vector symbols.

First, use File >> Open to open up the symbol catalog it's in, then select the Symbol Manager. Select all the symbols, and click Options. Set the "Force Sheet" option on and type SYMBOLS* in it. This will ensure that when you place the symbol in a template with sheets, it will always be placed on the SYMBOLS sheet, regardless of the current sheet, unless that sheet name starts with SYMBOL.

Save. There may be other symbol options only present in CC3 you want to set. I'll cover these below.

Open up a template with sheets onto which you want to place your symbols. Open up the catalog in the catalog window and place your symbol. It should be placed on the SYMBOLS sheet. Then, edit the effects on the sheet until the symbol looks just as you want.

Finally remove the symbol from the drawing and delete the defintion, then save the template with a new name.

Your symbol catalog will look good with any map based on your template.

Advanced symbol options:
Symbols can be divided over sheets. This allows you, for example, to have a detailed outline, but have the background to be blurred. If you look at the Mercator map or Strip map with effects on, you'll see this. The way it works is that you add a new line style to both the file with the catalog in, and the template, with the name of the sheet you want to include. Do this for each sheet, let's say SYMBOLS and SYMBOLS OUTLINE. Then, change the line style of the outline to say SYMBOLS OUTLINE, and the filled area to SYMBOLS.

Then in the Symbol Manager, select the symbols, select options, uncheck Force Sheet and select Line Styles to Sheet.

In your template, ensure the sheet, SYMBOLS OUTLINE comes after SYMBOLS, and set effects for the sheets, usually a blur on the symbols sheet. If you want a more painted over look (like a coloured John Speed map) you could put the SYMBOLS OUTLINE before the SYMBOLS sheet.

When you insert the symbols in a drawing made with your template, the background of the symbol will be blurred, the foreground not so.

If this is a bit shorthand, let me know if you need further details.

Repeater07

Thanks Simon!

I think this is what I was looking for on the advanced symbol options. I am not there yet, and will mainly focus on converting my user created CC2 to work with CC3, but playing around with some of the new effects is what I will want to do next, and I was not sure where to start.

I guess from a standards point if I want to make my symbols must usable, I place them all on the SYMBOLS sheet, but is there a naming standard past that when you start getting more advanced like you mentioned with the SYMBOLS OUTLINE?

Simon Rogers

Posted By: Repeater07
I guess from a standards point if I want to make my symbols must usable, I place them all on the SYMBOLS sheet, but is there a naming standard past that when you start getting more advanced like you mentioned with the SYMBOLS OUTLINE?

Ensure you start any sheets on which you place symbols with the word SYMBOLS and you'll be fine. Another example of this use is to do differing shadow lengths for different height objects. You can have SYMBOLS HIGH, SYMBOLS MEDIUM, SYMBOLS LOW, and even SYMBOLS FLOOR for symbols flush with the floor. Each would have a shadow filter with a different shadow length, except SYMBOLS FLOOR, which would have none.