Converting old CC-DOS maps to CC3+

Hello.

I recently found a collection of old maps made using CC-DOS in the late 90s. I tried opening them in CC3+, and though they do open, they don't look right. I found the following article explaining that these files need preparation in order to load them into CC3+:

In fact, since these maps were shared with me, I don't actually know how they're supposed to look. What I really want to have is an output of the maps as they would have looked back in 1998. Though I'm also interested in having a working version in CC3+, this is not completely necessary.

Either way, though, it seems that I need to have a copy of CC-DOS.

Which has brought me here, to ask the community if some kind soul with access to the original program would be willing to load up these maps for me, and save them as PNG files (and if possible as CC3+ files, too). I hear that it is functional through DOSbox.

I'd also love to hear any information you may have on whether these maps will look the same as they were designed to back in 1998. Is it possible they used art or fonts unique to the cartographer's system, for example?

Thank you for your time.


Comments

  • MonsenMonsen 🖼️ 43 images Mapmaker Administrator

    The reason these maps don't look right in CC3+ is that they use a font for symbols, and fonts back then was a completely different format than today's true type fonts.

    They look fine in CC-DOS once you configure it to use the right font (It doesn't store the font reference in the map the way CC3+ does), but I assume it is the SYMBOL2.FNT which looks right.

    Due to the use of the font, I am not sure if they can be made into CC3+ maps. There is a function for exploding text in CC-DOS but I don't really know how to use it, it seems to be expecting some input which I don't know what is.

    I should be able to export them if I can just remember the image export command.

    Thorf
  • ThorfThorf Newcomer

    Thank you very much for your help!

    If it's going to be hard to change them to CC3+ files, that's okay. I'm interested in these for their historical value as some of the earliest fan-made maps of this world, so all I really need is an export of each map.

    I tried installing CC3 and adding the SYMBOL2.FNT to its folder, as detailed in this thread:

    https://forum.profantasy.com/discussion/5297/opening-cc2-in-cc3?fbclid=IwAR3lH8Rxt4maEpjFD1gNOLfurfB0s0GFyrocKiDdeUOpjrkUqygx57mTVtk

    And I can now convert the text to that font, but I'm not good at this, and I'm doing it one letter at a time. I'm sure there's a far more efficient way of doing this!

  • MonsenMonsen 🖼️ 43 images Mapmaker Administrator
    edited October 14

    You can easily convert a lot of text at once by using Change Properties to change the text properties.

    Just hide the layer that contains text labels you don't want to change, and then just simply select everything in the map at once.

    Thorf
  • ThorfThorf Newcomer

    @Monsen Thank you very much for your help! I have been able to get the maps to display by changing the font in CC3.

    One last question: is there any way to tell what font the original maps used for their plain text? Is Arial just the default, or does the text in Arial indicate that the original map also used Arial?

    Many thanks for helping me to recover these twentysomething year old maps. 😊

  • MonsenMonsen 🖼️ 43 images Mapmaker Administrator
    edited October 14

    Not reliably. The old CC-DOS used a list of numbered fonts. I can tell what font number they used, and if they used the default font list, I can do some assumptions from that, but I already know they didn't use the defaults thanks to the Symbols2 font which I had to manually add to position 7.

    Arial is just a placeholder when the actual font is not found. I can guarantee that the old maps did not use arial, but due to the limited resolution in DOS, maps would tend to use mostly plain fonts.

    Here is an export of the Sebrun map from CC-DOS, which you can compare to the CC3 result below. Mostly very similar, but you can pick out a few small differences.

    I've put hi-res version of these in my gallery, but because on heavy reliance on 0-width lines, this makes them look horrible when zoomed out, but you can appreciate the detail when looking at them in 100% zoom (hint: middle click the thumbnails in the gallery to open the map in a new tab instead of the gallery viewer, this allows you to use the browser's zoom capabilities)


    LoopysueJimPMaidhc O CasainWyvernThorfQuenten
  • ThorfThorf Newcomer

    Thank you so much! These are awesome!

    I see what you mean about the high resolution maps. Those you posted in this thread end up coming out far better.

    I have managed to convert all of the maps to display properly in CC3 now. But your CC-DOS export definitely looks the best, I think — as well as being most authentic to how the maps would have looked at the time. Would you be able to export the rest of the set to PNG from CC-DOS? Sorry if this is asking a bit too much — you've been a great help already.

  • thehawkthehawk Traveler
    As beautiful as the maps CC3+ can do, there is something is still really like about this style.
    Thorf
  • RalfRalf 🖼️ 16 images Surveyor Administrator, ProFantasy

    Yes, I'm still very fond of my first major work with Campiagn Cartographer back in the day. :D

    See my gallery for versions redone in CC2 Pro and CC3. Interestingly the coastline is still the same path I drew in that very first map, point by point. It's been copied over from map to map. :)

    ThorfLoopysueMonsenJimPQuentenMaidhc O Casain
  • LoopysueLoopysue 🖼️ 10 images Mapmaker ProFantasy

    That's beautiful, Ralf :)

    Is this a style we can still use in CC3+ to make new maps?

  • MonsenMonsen 🖼️ 43 images Mapmaker Administrator
    edited October 15

    @Thorf wrote

    Would you be able to export the rest of the set to PNG from CC-DOS?

    Sure. What resolution do you want them exported in? The ones in the forum where exported in 2000 x 1500, the ones in the gallery 8000 x 6000


    @Loopysue wrote:

    Is this a style we can still use in CC3+ to make new maps?

    Yes. It is not defined as a style in CC3+, but the symbols are all there, and the rest is just (fractal) lines.

    Loopysue
  • ThorfThorf Newcomer

    Thank you very much, Monsen!

    2000 on the long edge seems like a good resolution, where it retains the detail without getting washed out. So if you can export them all at 2000 x 2000, that ought to do the job nicely.

  • 2000 pixels wide is what I typically put up on my web sites.

  • MonsenMonsen 🖼️ 43 images Mapmaker Administrator

    Since 2000px is larger than a post allows, I've uploaded all 12 images to my gallery, you should be able to grab them from there.

    LoopysueThorf
  • Thanks Remy !

  • ThorfThorf Newcomer

    Thank you once again for all of your generous assistance! I have downloaded all of the maps.

    For anyone who is interested, I plan to add them to the Atlas of Mystara web site at some point in the near future. They are among the earliest digital maps produced for the setting, and I want to highlight their position as some of the first of hundreds of fan-made maps of Mystara.

    QuentenJimPRaiko
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