lol... well it was enough to get Sue to see why my effects weren't working on my text, and that's all I needed!
Thanks Mark! That means quite a bit coming from you. Of course, I kind of got a bit of that from that facebook page we don't like to mention. I actually read some of the comments on the maps of mine that were pulled for that site... and one of the comments for either my castle map, or my Horn & Stars Tavern, was that they always LOVE seeing maps made in Dundjinni!!!
Once I got over my initial infuriation, I realized that was actually a compliment that they couldn't tell it was made in cc3+!!!
huh... I didn't know that! That would help immensely!
I also noticed that my melted ground didn't render, so I'm going to have to fix that... so I may be reposting anyway. unfortunately, my ride will be here to pick me up fairly soon, so I don't have the time to fix and repost today. Will definitely do it Friday, when I have more time.
Posted By: LadieStormI actually read some of the comments on the maps of mine that were pulled for that site... and one of the comments for either my castle map, or my Horn & Stars Tavern, was that they always LOVE seeing maps made in Dundjinni!!!
Once I got over my initial infuriation, I realized that was actually a compliment that they couldn't tell it was made in cc3+!!!
One should understand that Dundjinni barely still exists. The current version 1.07 is more than 10 years old, and although Daniel Pryor is doing his best to revive DJ (Give him a clap on the back!), it's doubtful that there ever will be a new version. And yes ... I hope I'm wrong there. The Dundjinni group has given the rest of us endless resources of top quality.
Dundjinni was designed to make battlemaps. Period. One has to stretch it like a rubber band to make decent village maps, and it's mostly forgettable for overland maps. But it was designed beautifully for making battlemaps. Bogie and others made battlemaps with Dundjinni that rivaled anything that one could do in The GIMP or Photoshop.
However, to my amazement, we now have the three Ls (LadieStorm, L....Sue and Lorelei), who are showing us with great glee that anything the GIMPers and Photoshopers can do, they can do better with CC3+. Wow and gee golly whillikers! I like it.
And being a male who long has thought that the feminine side of the human race is God's greatest invention, I'm absolutely enthused that the three Ls are showing the members of this long male-dominated forum how to do it.
Oh I don't know that I feel all that special really. There are some damn fine maps around here that are nothing to do with me, but I must confess to feeling quite proud that my work was good enough to be stolen - even in its unfinished state
At the risk of hijacking this thread, I'll add this tidbit and then bow out:
Dundjinni was using bitmaps and "photorealistic" symbols and bitmap fills long before CC3/DD3 started to do so (or long enough before). Much of the amazement or confusion you've seen is likely from people who remember CC2/DD2 being mostly vector graphics or CC3/DD3 being mostly hand-drawn art. SS2 introduced more of a "Dundjinni" look to CC3/DD3 and the addition of CC3 effects gave walls beveling, which Dundjinni used to do. So your recent maps are more reminiscent of Dundjinni than what people are used to seeing from CC3.
Storm, the map turned out great! The floorplans on the bottom are perfect. Good job with this one!
Posted By: Vintyri
Posted By: LadieStorm
However, to my amazement, we now have the three Ls (LadieStorm, L....Sue and Lorelei), who are showing us with great glee that anything the GIMPers and Photoshopers can do, they can do better with CC3+. Wow and gee golly whillikers! I like it.
And being a male who long has thought that the feminine side of the human race is God's greatest invention, I'm absolutely enthused that the three Ls are showing the members of this long male-dominated forum how to do it.
Net schlecht, as we say here in Bavarian Franggn!
And, Mark...thank you for your compliment. I've still so far to go, but when i look back at my first maps and these....i am amazed with myself - as i've said I truly have very little computer knowledge other than the basics and of course my medical charting systems at the hospital - so to be able to utilize this fantastic program and actually give it credit with my maps is pretty damn cool
I haven't been doing this as long as you have...and I remember you showing me some of your first maps, Lorelei. I also remember you telling me that in a few months I would be making maps I didn't think we're possible then.
I didn't believe you. I thought it would take me a year or more before I was good enough to put my maps beside yours. You and Shessar are still better than I am, and that's fine with me, you both have more experience! And Sue... I don't k ow how long you have been Making maps...you are extraordinary! I will say this. I thought my first maps were good. And for me, they were, and still are, considering how new I was to mapping at the time. But the stuff I'm doing now...I thought would take me years to learn to make!
Well lets just say I went to a real bona fide art college when I was 17. I've been painting for... um... a couple of decades, and before I turned my attention to the need for maps to go with the books I'm writing I already knew a whole load of stuff about colour and light that you just wouldn't believe unless I demonstrated it to you right in front of your eyes. On top of that, I have about fifteen years experience with 3D graphics packages like Blender, Bryce, Truspace and Vue, and there's not a lot I couldn't do with CorelDraw (except that the software is massively out of date and will probably fail altogether the next time Microsoft go and update Win 10).
That's not tcheating hon, that's called having experience. That would compare to telling me I was cheating g the first time I posted a poem for public review, because I paid my way through college by writing poetry for American Greeting Cards (which I did).
There is never anything wrong g with experience. And the fact that you also went to art school says you have talent on top of that. Which also explains why you draw such amazing maps! And I thank God for you...all of you really. You all challenge me to improve and grow, and adapt and innovate. That's what it's all about !
Posted By: VintyriMoral of the story: If you're not making maps that use only official CC3+ symbols and fills, forget about posting FCW files.
This is only partially true. As long as you use art from a 'published symbol pack', it doesn't matter if it is official ProFantasy or a community pack, like the great stuff you yourself have been providing. As long as the symbol catalogs are made correctly, they will use a relative reference to the CC3+ data directory (or CC3 installation directory), so it doesn't matter where exactly on your computer stuff is, the only requirement is that you have installed the same symbol set (But this is true of PF official add-ons as well). The important information that should follow a .fcw is which add-ons/symbols sets have been used to create it so you know what to expect (or what to get if you wish to use the .fcw).
Of course, if you use symbols you have manually found/imported yourself, that is another matter entirely. Still doable, but you need to make sure bitmap references are all relative, and you also need to distribute them along with the map. The references are not difficult, but it becomes a bit of work if you didn't do them relative to the data directory or mapfrom the start.
Posted By: LadieStormI actually read some of the comments on the maps of mine that were pulled for that site... and one of the comments for either my castle map, or my Horn & Stars Tavern, was that they always LOVE seeing maps made in Dundjinni!!!
Once I got over my initial infuriation, I realized that was actually a compliment that they couldn't tell it was made in cc3+!!!
One should understand that Dundjinni barely still exists. The current version 1.07 is more than 10 years old, and although Daniel Pryor is doing his best to revive DJ (Give him a clap on the back!), it's doubtful that there ever will be a new version. And yes ... I hope I'm wrong there. The Dundjinni group has given the rest of us endless resources of top quality.
Dundjinni was designed to make battlemaps. Period. One has to stretch it like a rubber band to make decent village maps, and it's mostly forgettable for overland maps. But it was designed beautifully for making battlemaps. Bogie and others made battlemaps with Dundjinni that rivaled anything that one could do in The GIMP or Photoshop.
However, to my amazement, we now have the three Ls (LadieStorm, L....Sue and Lorelei), who are showing us with great glee that anything the GIMPers and Photoshopers can do, they can do better with CC3+. Wow and gee golly whillikers! I like it.
And being a male who long has thought that the feminine side of the human race is God's greatest invention, I'm absolutely enthused that the three Ls are showing the members of this long male-dominated forum how to do it.
Net schlecht, as we say here in Bavarian Franggn!
Posted By: Monsen
Posted By: VintyriMoral of the story: If you're not making maps that use only official CC3+ symbols and fills, forget about posting FCW files.
This is only partially true. As long as you use art from a 'published symbol pack', it doesn't matter if it is official ProFantasy or a community pack, like the great stuff you yourself have been providing. As long as the symbol catalogs are made correctly, they will use a relative reference to the CC3+ data directory (or CC3 installation directory), so it doesn't matter where exactly on your computer stuff is, the only requirement is that you have installed the same symbol set (But this is true of PF official add-ons as well). The important information that should follow a .fcw is which add-ons/symbols sets have been used to create it so you know what to expect (or what to get if you wish to use the .fcw).
Of course, if you use symbols you have manually found/imported yourself, that is another matter entirely. Still doable, but you need to make sure bitmap references are all relative, and you also need to distribute them along with the map. The references are not difficult, but it becomes a bit of work if you didn't do them relative to the data directory or mapfrom the start.
I tried to tell you this on the Guild website Mark. I'm glad to see you've come around. I am sorry our discussion over there got so heated. My apologies for that.
I have to agree with you as well. These ladies are making some incredible artwork with this stuff. I love it!
Remy is quite correct in stating that FCW originals of maps made with art packs such as the Bogie Collection, the CSUAC and our Vintyri collection are quite portable ... if the user on the other end also has these free arts packs installed. However, that IF is the big issue. If the user uses CD3 graphics and the viewer on the other side doesn't have CD3, the red Xs appear.
Posted By: Monsenthe important information that should follow a .fcw is which add-ons/symbols sets have been used to create it so you know what to expect (or what to get if you wish to use the .fcw).
Of course, if you use symbols you have manually found/imported yourself, that is another matter entirely. Still doable, but you need to make sure bitmap references are all relative, and you also need to distribute them along with the map. The references are not difficult, but it becomes a bit of work if you didn't do them relative to the data directory or map from the start.
Distributing the symbols along with with your map usually is not possible because it's not legal.
This is where things get problematical in almost all FCWs that I've seen posted here. Some have graphic objects from the annuals. Red Xs if you don't have the annuals. Some have graphic objects from SS1, SS2, SS3 or SS4. Red Xs if you don't have them. And ever more people are (commendably) importing symbols from the Dundjinni forums and other sources and then putting them in custom folders with custom files. There's no chance of avoiding red Xs there.
I have CC3, CC3+, CD3, DD3 and CA3 ... not a complete package to be sure, but fairly comprehensive. I also have the Vintyri Collection, the Bogie collection, the CSUAC in both the older version from Shessar and the new one from us (not released yet - beta testing will start soon), but I can't remember the last time I looked at someone's FCW and didn't get red Xs somewhere.
I said this back in the early days of CC3 and I still think it: It would be a great boon to users if ProFantasy would give us the option of embedding symbols and fills, like FM8 and Dundjinni do. The red X problem could be resolved. ProFantasy also could make its own symbols unembeddable to avoid theft, if desired. But as long as embedding remains impossible, I'll stick with my opinion: If you're not making maps that use only official CC3+ symbols and fills, forget about posting FCW files.
Hi Ladiestorm. Great to see you too! I've just been going through some things that have prevented me from being on much. But there is light at the end of the tunnel so I'm hoping to be back to map making soon.
I realized the other day, when I posted my completed bandit camp map... it wasn't actually complete! There was a sheet or two that was hidden. So I'm reposting the complete map with those sheets no longer hidden. I also straightened my text (thanks Sue for finding that fix!!!)
probably not... but you know... I don't mind if I don't win. While it would be nice, that's not what the challenge is really about. It's about challenging ourselves to become better mappers, to improve the quality of our maps. To try new things, and experiment with new techniques. What truly matters to me, is that this map is better than the last one I made which was better than the one before it. Each time I make a map, I learn something, and each time I make a map, it's better than the one before it.
okay... apparently when I changed out the bridge, I somehow moved the sheet it was on... even though I didn't mess with the sheets at all. It caused my snow to be on top of my bridge, don't know how that happened!
Comments
Thanks Mark! That means quite a bit coming from you. Of course, I kind of got a bit of that from that facebook page we don't like to mention. I actually read some of the comments on the maps of mine that were pulled for that site... and one of the comments for either my castle map, or my Horn & Stars Tavern, was that they always LOVE seeing maps made in Dundjinni!!!
Once I got over my initial infuriation, I realized that was actually a compliment that they couldn't tell it was made in cc3+!!!
CC3+ IS my Photoshop. Does most of the same things - just uses different processes to get there.
EDIT: Look, will you please stop ninja-ing me! LOL!
I also noticed that my melted ground didn't render, so I'm going to have to fix that... so I may be reposting anyway. unfortunately, my ride will be here to pick me up fairly soon, so I don't have the time to fix and repost today. Will definitely do it Friday, when I have more time.
Dundjinni was designed to make battlemaps. Period. One has to stretch it like a rubber band to make decent village maps, and it's mostly forgettable for overland maps. But it was designed beautifully for making battlemaps. Bogie and others made battlemaps with Dundjinni that rivaled anything that one could do in The GIMP or Photoshop.
However, to my amazement, we now have the three Ls (LadieStorm, L....Sue and Lorelei), who are showing us with great glee that anything the GIMPers and Photoshopers can do, they can do better with CC3+. Wow and gee golly whillikers! I like it.
And being a male who long has thought that the feminine side of the human race is God's greatest invention, I'm absolutely enthused that the three Ls are showing the members of this long male-dominated forum how to do it.
Net schlecht, as we say here in Bavarian Franggn!
I just realized something... I can't call myself a newbie anymore, can I?
Dundjinni was using bitmaps and "photorealistic" symbols and bitmap fills long before CC3/DD3 started to do so (or long enough before). Much of the amazement or confusion you've seen is likely from people who remember CC2/DD2 being mostly vector graphics or CC3/DD3 being mostly hand-drawn art. SS2 introduced more of a "Dundjinni" look to CC3/DD3 and the addition of CC3 effects gave walls beveling, which Dundjinni used to do. So your recent maps are more reminiscent of Dundjinni than what people are used to seeing from CC3.
I didn't believe you. I thought it would take me a year or more before I was good enough to put my maps beside yours. You and Shessar are still better than I am, and that's fine with me, you both have more experience! And Sue... I don't k ow how long you have been Making maps...you are extraordinary! I will say this. I thought my first maps were good. And for me, they were, and still are, considering how new I was to mapping at the time. But the stuff I'm doing now...I thought would take me years to learn to make!
How?
Well lets just say I went to a real bona fide art college when I was 17. I've been painting for... um... a couple of decades, and before I turned my attention to the need for maps to go with the books I'm writing I already knew a whole load of stuff about colour and light that you just wouldn't believe unless I demonstrated it to you right in front of your eyes. On top of that, I have about fifteen years experience with 3D graphics packages like Blender, Bryce, Truspace and Vue, and there's not a lot I couldn't do with CorelDraw (except that the software is massively out of date and will probably fail altogether the next time Microsoft go and update Win 10).
So you see, hun - I'm cheating all right
There is never anything wrong g with experience. And the fact that you also went to art school says you have talent on top of that. Which also explains why you draw such amazing maps! And I thank God for you...all of you really. You all challenge me to improve and grow, and adapt and innovate. That's what it's all about
As long as the symbol catalogs are made correctly, they will use a relative reference to the CC3+ data directory (or CC3 installation directory), so it doesn't matter where exactly on your computer stuff is, the only requirement is that you have installed the same symbol set (But this is true of PF official add-ons as well). The important information that should follow a .fcw is which add-ons/symbols sets have been used to create it so you know what to expect (or what to get if you wish to use the .fcw).
Of course, if you use symbols you have manually found/imported yourself, that is another matter entirely. Still doable, but you need to make sure bitmap references are all relative, and you also need to distribute them along with the map. The references are not difficult, but it becomes a bit of work if you didn't do them relative to the data directory or mapfrom the start.
I have to agree with you as well. These ladies are making some incredible artwork with this stuff. I love it!
This is where things get problematical in almost all FCWs that I've seen posted here. Some have graphic objects from the annuals. Red Xs if you don't have the annuals. Some have graphic objects from SS1, SS2, SS3 or SS4. Red Xs if you don't have them. And ever more people are (commendably) importing symbols from the Dundjinni forums and other sources and then putting them in custom folders with custom files. There's no chance of avoiding red Xs there.
I have CC3, CC3+, CD3, DD3 and CA3 ... not a complete package to be sure, but fairly comprehensive. I also have the Vintyri Collection, the Bogie collection, the CSUAC in both the older version from Shessar and the new one from us (not released yet - beta testing will start soon), but I can't remember the last time I looked at someone's FCW and didn't get red Xs somewhere.
I said this back in the early days of CC3 and I still think it: It would be a great boon to users if ProFantasy would give us the option of embedding symbols and fills, like FM8 and Dundjinni do. The red X problem could be resolved. ProFantasy also could make its own symbols unembeddable to avoid theft, if desired. But as long as embedding remains impossible, I'll stick with my opinion: If you're not making maps that use only official CC3+ symbols and fills, forget about posting FCW files.
Cheers,
~Dogtag
That's what the challenges are about
It's fixed now... so let's try this again!