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      CommentAuthor01i
    • CommentTimeNov 28th 2019
     
    I now own most of the ProFantasy software products, there are a couple of annuals that I've yet to pick up because they don't have anything that I really needed with any urgency, and a couple of other bits of software that I don't really need at all.

    Every time a new voucher pops up in my email (like the 30% Black Friday one that arrived today), I have a flick through the older bits of software, and the one thing that I keep coming back to are the Source Maps - or more specifically, as I already own City Designer - the `Castles` and `Temples, Tombs & Catacombs` source maps.

    Both of these products are a couple of generations old now, but the artwork isn't on par with what we get in CC3+ and Perspectives 3. On top of that, we've had a few recent reworks in this years annual: Beaumaris Castle in May 2019, a couple of Ancient Egypt tomb styles in June and August 2019.

    I'm wondering whether or not it's still worth picking up the `Castles` and `Temples, Tombs & Catacombs` packs for the additional tools they offer, (e.g. Castle Designer Pro), or whether at this point I should just wait and see what 2020 has to offer.
    • CommentAuthorJimP
    • CommentTimeNov 28th 2019
     
    They are good examples on how to use the software. I modified and used one of the Tombs for a burial site of an earlier king.
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      CommentAuthor01i
    • CommentTimeNov 28th 2019
     
    Posted By: JimPThey are good examples on how to use the software. I modified and used one of the Tombs for a burial site of an earlier king.


    Recently? I.e would you still use them now with all the other newer resources available to you?
    • CommentAuthorJimP
    • CommentTimeNov 28th 2019
     
    Most of my game maps are out of my imagination, but I can still use them for map starts and ideas.

    Its a holiday in the U.S, but other people might be around later on.
  1.  
    I have printed the lot of them out from the PDF which is included and use them to drop into campaigns. Whenever I need a city, town, castle, dungeon or cave system I can just snag one. If you don't have a use for the maps in your game, they probably aren't worthwhile, but if you do need sets of detailed floorplans and 3D views you can adapt them easily.
    • CommentAuthortreczoks
    • CommentTimeDec 3rd 2019
     
    I bought them at 30% off, and they are quite nice. I'm still a beginner, and I already found a lot of techniques I intend to copy/adapt for my own maps.

    One thing is seriously annoying, though: In the PDFs, the orientation of the maps change seemingly at random. The PDF has the pages in portrait mode, but most maps are in landscape, so they are either rotated clockwise or counterclockwise. If they could only decide on one orientation and stick to it.
  2.  
    Posted By: treczoks

    One thing is seriously annoying, though: In the PDFs, the orientation of the maps change seemingly at random. The PDF has the pages in portrait mode, but most maps are in landscape, so they are either rotated clockwise or counterclockwise. If they could only decide on one orientation and stick to it.


    They were rotated to take up as much space on the page as possible, for printing. I can understand why that's frustrating when you want to use them as a PDF.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeDec 5th 2019
     
    When I had a nice little job administrating the QMS for a private company, you could turn the page orientation around and save it that way. Can this no longer be done? I have to ask because I don't have that job any more and no access to Acrobat pro.
    • CommentAuthortreczoks
    • CommentTime4 days ago
     
    Posted By: Simon RogersThey were rotated to take up as much space on the page as possible, for printing.


    That was never the question. The point is: Why are some rotated 90° left and others 90° right? This even happens with different levels of a single map.

    Take the castles guide. Starting on page 16, there is a map of a "Vauban-style Fortress". The first level on page 16 is rotated right, the second on page 17 is rotated left, and the third level on page 18 is again rotated right.

    So even pages are rotated right, and odd pages are rotated left. Which makes no sense. Even if have this printed as a book with opposite pages, you'll have to rotate the book round and round! It is completely impractical.
    •  
      CommentAuthor01i
    • CommentTime4 days ago edited
     
    Posted By: treczoksSo even pages are rotated right, and odd pages are rotated left. Which makes no sense. Even if have this printed as a book with opposite pages, you'll have to rotate the book round and round! It is completely impractical.


    Wouldn't that mean that if you printed out the PDF a page to an A4 page, in duplex, the bottom of the map would point the same way on both sides?

    On a side note, Simon, is there a way to unsubscribe to one of your own threads? because the question was actually about whether or not they were still worth buying, and that doesn't seem to be what's being discussed.
    •  
      CommentAuthorMonsen
    • CommentTime4 days ago
     
    The option to unsubscribe should be in the menu to the left.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTime4 days ago
     
    Sorry 01i! :(
  3.  
    Posted By: 01i
    Posted By: treczoksSo even pages are rotated right, and odd pages are rotated left. Which makes no sense. Even if have this printed as a book with opposite pages, you'll have to rotate the book round and round! It is completely impractical.


    Wouldn't that mean that if you printed out the PDF a page to an A4 page, in duplex, the bottom of the map would point the same way on both sides?

    On a side note, Simon, is there a way to unsubscribe to one of your own threads? because the question was actually about whether or not they were still worth buying, and that doesn't seem to be what's being discussed.


    Sorry - I'm out of this thread.
    • CommentAuthorJimP
    • CommentTime4 days ago
     
    Here is one of the tombs maps I slightly modified for a burial of a 'Mad King'.

    Stonehenge type, surrounding area. I took out some of the standing stones, and the stones in the center. Addded some trees.
      madkrongos_burial.PNG
    • CommentAuthorWyvern
    • CommentTime3 days ago
     
    You're being a bit too modest about the changes you made here Jim. Filling-in all those holes, shifting tons of standing stones, levelling the banks of the old Main Access route, and changing to stones of a different colour in the central ring - even removing the North Barrow, never mind all that tree-planting!

    For anyone confused, it's worth comparing Jim's revised map with the original from the Temples, Tombs & Catacombs Source Maps pack via the examples page. Conveniently, the not-Stonehenge example original opens in an almost identical-sized window (well, it does using Chrome) so you can make an easy side-by-side comparison.

    Have to say this looks really good to me, and I just wonder if it might be interesting to use some similarly reworked items from the Source Maps for adding to the Community Atlas?
    •  
      CommentAuthorQuenten
    • CommentTime3 days ago edited
     
    I used the Parthenon map for my Stromphe temple
      B Atlas G 2 2b ii Typical temple VERY SMALL.png
      parthenon1.PNG
    •  
      CommentAuthorMonsen
    • CommentTime3 days ago
     
    Posted By: WyvernHave to say this looks really good to me, and I just wonder if it might be interesting to use some similarly reworked items from the Source Maps for adding to theCommunity Atlas?
    You would need ProFantasy's express permission to do that. Their license don't allow redistribution of their maps.
    If you're only inspired by them, like Quenten's map, that's fine, but taking the actual map and make changes, like JimP's, it's not. It is fine for personal use of course, that's part of the intention of the maps, but not for redistributing like in the atlas.
    • CommentAuthorWyvern
    • CommentTime1 day ago
     
    Posted By: Monsen
    Posted By: WyvernHave to say this looks really good to me, and I just wonder if it might be interesting to use some similarly reworked items from the Source Maps for adding to theCommunity Atlas?
    You would need ProFantasy's express permission to do that. Their license don't allow redistribution of their maps.
    If you're only inspired by them, like Quenten's map, that's fine, but taking the actual map and make changes, like JimP's, it's not. It is fine for personal use of course, that's part of the intention of the maps, but not for redistributing like in the atlas.


    That's disappointing. Not having any of the Source Maps installed, I wasn't aware of the contents of their EULA, of course.

    I'm also puzzled as to how this is enforceable, given features such as the TRACE and CONTOURSM commands in CC3+ now. How can anyone "prove" a map such as Jim's - which to my eye involves some substantial changes to the original Source Maps product, while still being based on/in the style of it - hasn't simply been drawn/redrawn by the claimed creator?

    Does this also mean that maps which look quite similar to those in the Source Maps, but which don't use them as a basis, also can't be redistributed? For instance, because the map Jim used as his starting point is freely available via the PF website as an image, what's to stop anyone using that PNG image as an import to CC3+, redrawing the map using all the features of CC3+, but without necessarily even having the Source Maps installed, and then redistributing that map as their own work? More importantly, how could you prove it one way or the other to enforce the EULA?

    I can understand how items such as symbols or bitmaps can be protected this way under a EULA, but not maps drawn including such features - given that's the basis for projects like the Community Atlas.