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    So I am working on a continent its 2400 miles by 1700 miles. The issue is getting the symbols the right size to match the world for a world map view. I see maps that look amazing and the scale shows 200 miles and matches the symbols. When I try it looks all wanky, any tips for drawing a world map with dimension of 2400 x 1700 for symbol size and export information? Any help would be great. Thank you in advance.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeAug 2nd 2019
    Default symbol size is usually '1', and set up that way in the template. In most cases just leaving the symbols the default size will generate a visually pleasing map, as long as you create your map the right size in map units (overland map units represent 1 mile, city and dungeon map units represent 1 foot)

    Something to bear in mind is that overland symbols are symbolic and not intended to be realistic in scale. This is because on a world map a tree would be nothing more than a dot and unrecognizable as a tree - but you still need to have the tree symbols to show where the rainforests are. Overland symbols are designed to be easily recognisable and aesthetically pleasing. So a tree symbol may well be many times too large compared to the mountain symbol beside it. The point is that it is recognisable as a tree - a symbol of a tree instead of a little black dot. Coupled with this is the concept that a single tree symbol on an overland map may represent a copse, or even a small woodland because of the area it covers on the map

    On city and dungeon maps the default symbol scale of 1 is more closely linked with a realistic size for the object the symbol represents. So a city tree will be approximately 20-30 feet across the crown on the map, and in scale with the map scale. In dungeon maps in particular a table or a barrel will be the right size according to the map scale - as long as you leave the symbol scale set to the default value of 1.

    When to break the rules and alter the symbol scale and set it at something other than 1...

    This is a wonderfully vague area of discussion and very difficult to describe. In dungeon and city maps I would say hardly ever, since you wouldn't want a kitchen table that was 20 foot long (except in a very large castle perhaps). In overland maps, however, where the symbols are already an unrealistic size compared to the scale of the map, alterations in a few symbols here and there across the map might be used to emphasis important points, or to generate some kind of perspective effect. for example if the whole point of the map is to show the cities on a world map you might make the city symbols outrageously too large compared to the scale of the map (a city would only be a very small dot on such a map) just to make sure that the information was easily visible on the map. However, once you start playing around with the symbol size in a map it is very easy to lose control of the way it looks, so I would recommend sticking with the default symbol scale of 1 until you become more familiar with the whole concept of map symbols.
    • CommentTimeAug 2nd 2019
    Posted By: LoopysueDefault symbol size is usually '1', and set up that way in the template.
    Not quite true. For overland maps, default symbol scale is map width divided by 1000.
    There is quite a difference of opinion on that particular setting however. The reason it is as it is is because it is intended to make a map that is readable when zoomed out. The thought is that if you make a map of a larger area, it will by it's very nature be less detailed than a map of a smaller area (just like real world atlas maps). The thinking here is also that the symbols represents a feature being there more than accurately depict it in detail.

    Some people don't like this however, and prefer that the scale should be closer to 1 no matter the map scale, because they feel the symbols gets too big, a single mountain symbol may cover an entire mountain range for example, and they prefer to go in and provide more detail which is afforded by smaller scale symbol. This usually makes the map look better when zoomed in, but often have a cost in that the map looks more messy when you zoom out to view the entire map. This thinking does allow for many features to be more accurately depicted though.
  2. the western lands is a great example. this map looks huge and is detailed yet the size of 75% of my continent. must be in the save settings
    • CommentAuthorJimP
    • CommentTimeAug 3rd 2019
    I don't use that many symbols for continent or region maps. What you use is up to you. Reload/load times will be affected the more symbols there are.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeAug 3rd 2019 edited
    I've done a bit of research (that means I borrowed The Western Lands, imported it into a default blank Mike Schley template, and matched everything size for size to the best of my abilities)

    Going on the scale of the textures (which don't appear to have been adjusted relative to one another) in relation to the size of the map and the thickness of the blue border line, the map appears to be the default size of 1000 x 800 map units. Symbol size, however, varies depending on what type of symbol is being used.

    The mountains were nearly all the two small mountain collections and invariably scaled at about 0.5. So were the trees - scaled at 0.5.

    The hills, however are much smaller. They are between 0.1 and 0.2 default size

    The settlements vary hugely between 0.35 and 0.7 - the largest being the tinier symbols like the towers, and the smallest being the larger settlements like the cities. altering the settlement size between settlements isn't generally a great idea, but Loudwolf seems to make it work by having those different scale settlement symbols quite a long way apart from each other.

    So to make a map like The Western Lands I would start with the default Mike Schley template (1000 x 800 map units) and set the default symbol size to 0.5 instead of 1 and get the mountains down first, then consider the hills, remembering that if you want it to look like that particular map you will have to reduce the symbol size down to about 0.2 for the hills (though I would do that by right clicking the cursor and setting it by hand rather than changing the default size, which will still need to be 0.5 when you do all those trees). Then see what you've got and kind of feel your way through the rest of the map once you have the basics in line.

    The trees were all pasted individually. As far as I can tell he didn't use any of the copse options.

    I hope that helps a bit :)
    Yes it does. So the map scale 0-200 miles is not accurate so my continent I am working on could go on standereds size make it look good then set the scale bar to what I wants as size, still having my continent 2400 x 1700 miles, but using the standard 1000x800. Thank you that guidence I know where to go from here. Once I get started I'll post here to show my progress. What would you recommend for settings for saving as jpeg using standereds 1000 x 800?
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeAug 4th 2019
    As long as you don't expect to be able to take accurate measurements off the map no one can stop you doing it how big or small you want. Always remember, though, that a single map unit is a mile as far as CC3 is concerned in an overland map.

    As for rendering, it doesn't really matter how big or small you want to render it. A few trial renders will show up any problems with label size (worth getting right before you do too many labels because you have to edit them individually). Don't forget that you can increase or decrease the size of the render using the Options button in the Save as dialogue. Set the height and width proportional to the map however large you do it in the end. For example, 2000 x 1600, 3000 x 2400, 4000 x 3200, etc. Check all the little boxes at the bottom of that Save as Options dialog (with the exception of the Launch image viewer) makes things a lot easier.

    If you have any problems with it just say :)
    • CommentTimeAug 5th 2019
    Posted By: ProfessorKizso my continent I am working on could go on standereds size make it look good then set the scale bar to what I wants as size, still having my continent 2400 x 1700 miles, but using the standard 1000x800.
    My recommendation is to never ever do that. Always start a map in the correct size for the map, don't just fudge the scale bar in the end. By not having the map itself in the correct size you'll never be able to use the measuring tools, you won't be able to use the coordinates and such to guide you, and you'll quickly run into problems if you try to make a smaller scale map from part of your map.

    The best approach when handling scale is always to start the map in the scale you need. Default symbol scale can easily be changed. If you think the symbol scale on a 1000x800 map looks good for your use, but your world is 2400x1700, then start the map in 2400x1700 and simply set the symbol scale to 2.4. That will give the exact same visual look as symbol scale 1 on 1000x800, but measurments will be correct, which is a big thing.
    You can also read the article I wrote on the subject.
    Lets see how this works...
    Thank you Monsen, im read up and try again. This is one of 4 Continents I have, its the second largest and trying to get the "Continent view" I liked the size and scale of the western lands. Thank you for all help and suggestions, this community is AMAZING!!!
    Well here is a closer view of some of the continent, now to figure exporting out. I know this forum has to be a max of 1020 x 1020 pxl and doesnt do this justice. Even messing with it to fit in roll20 (10Mb max) and discord (8Mb max). Trying to get it to look like the western lands once it is exported (saved as jpeg). Any suggestions?
      Dnd world partial.JPG
    • CommentAuthorJimP
    • CommentTimeAug 9th 2019
    You could post a forum sized one here, and link to a larger version elsewhere.
    lol I followed the instructions to add a link and got this ^...... Opps. Any ways this is my world so far.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeAug 9th 2019
    You can do things like increase the compression on a jpg, but it causes a lot of undesirable artefacts - a bit like the whole thing has been drawn on a piece of tartan textured cloth.

    I'm afraid decent graphics are large, and that's all there is to it. So you might want to export at two resolutions - one for printing for yourself or screen display at home, and one for use in your games.
    Hopefully this works..... if it did what do yall think?
    • CommentAuthorJimP
    • CommentTimeAug 13th 2019
    Looks better... but for continents I don't put roads, towns, etc. 2400 miles is continent size. Up to you.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeAug 13th 2019
    Great work! :)

    This is going to be quite a masterpiece when its done :)
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeAug 15th 2019
    LOL! I was staring with intent at the main continent trying to work out what you had done since the last time, and completely failed to notice that you had added a huge new island!

    Nice work :)
    lol I have another addition, upper left corner on the next pic uploaded..
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeAug 20th 2019
    A bit of hydrothermal action going on there!

    Nice work :D
    Im actually thinking on doing this view in the 13th age with less detail. I seen a map of Faerun world map, and a large scale map of forgotten realms. Gave me some ideas. I think I will use this design for regional areas. Ill keep posting as I do more. I am loving the feed back on my mapping. Thank you so much.
    Yeah due to lore and story that small continent about broke apart, it once was covered in ice and now is a ticking time bomb, void of most life. It is even protected by cliffs all away around except one spot but the waters are far more dangerous.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeAug 20th 2019
    Just as I am enjoying watching this develop :)
    lol I have to finish what I started first then try it in 13th age. cant NOT finish it in this format first. lol
    Another update
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeAug 22nd 2019
    You're nearly there now :)

    Seeing it in another style will be really interesting.
    Kingdom boarders added now whoot. Need to finish the the Drakenhiem area and bam add my lore to the parts I have yet to actually work on lol
    • CommentTimeAug 27th 2019
    Looks good, but the text for the kingdoms looks a bit overwhelming to me - perhaps reducing font size would be a thought?
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeAug 27th 2019
    It looks great :)

    I think you could possibly get away with smaller differences as you go up in the scale of the labels from city to country name, and not quite so many different colours, but that is just personal taste ;)
    • CommentAuthorJimP
    • CommentTimeAug 27th 2019
    Border colors is from one of the Annuals.
    Thanx for the feed back sorry I haven't updated getting ready for a possible direct hit from Hurricane Dorian.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeSep 1st 2019
    :O Oh dear!

    Keep safe!
    • CommentTimeSep 1st 2019
    That really doesn't seem safe. I hope you and yours will stay safe through it.
    • CommentAuthorJimP
    • CommentTimeSep 1st 2019
    Dorian just became a category 5 storm as it is just getting to the Bahamas.

    Scroll down past the large map to the wind speed and rain predictions.

    Here are the wind scales, so you know what the categories are.
    Yeah it destroyed the Bahamas and curved away from us up to carolina's. Strongest storm in the atlantic in 49 years 185 miles an hour cat 5.....Yikes. On another note I am in the process of messing with this map and basically tripling this in size.
    • CommentAuthorVexikuri
    • CommentTimeOct 7th 2019 edited
    Love the colored borders.

    What annual has the colored borders?