Making symbols in a symbol catalogue place randomly

kevbeck43 · January 2019

I have a symbol catalogue full of Harnic trees. The problem is I have to click on each symbol separately to place them. I know I am missing something easy but I want to set it up so that the symbols will cycle to the next one in the catalogue with each click. I have looked in the Tomb and other places but I can't find that specific bit.

kathorus · January 2019

The symbols have to part of a collection. If they are, then there should be a plus sign that you can use to expand and collapse the collection. In addition, they need to have an R indicator as well which marks them as random. Pg 92 and 93 of the Tome (pdf version) explains it, you can search for "Using Symbols" if you're using another type of reader.

kevbeck43 · January 2019

I know how the collections work. I wanted to create one from an .FSC file that I have. The file is not connected to any style. They are stand alone symbols I put in my CC3+ Cities symbols folder.

I should probably say what I did...

I went to the Symbols Manager and clicked all the symbols that I wanted. They are all numbered and in the same catalogue. Then I went to options and checked symbols are part of a collection and the random option. I also forced them to my trees sheet (that worked by the way) but I didn't see a + or a r anywhere in the catalogue after I did that. I don't know what else to do.

Loopysue · January 2019

That is correct. In addition to that all the symbols must be named the same thing. For example "Tree 01", "Tree 02", "Tree 03" and so on. You also need to be careful you don't use the same name as any existing symbols or you will end up with a confusion. So it would probably be better to make the name something like "Harnic tree 01".

Don't miss any of the numbers out of the sequence, and arrange them in the correct order in the Symbol Manager one after the other without any of the other symbols in the catalogue mixed up with them.

kevbeck43 · January 2019

Posted By: LoopysueThat is correct. In addition to that all the symbols must be named the same thing. For example "Tree 01", "Tree 02", "Tree 03" and so on. You also need to be careful you don't use the same name as any existing symbols or you will end up with a confusion. So it would probably be better to make the name something like "Harnic tree 01".

Don't miss any of the numbers out of the sequence, and arrange them in the correct order in the Symbol Manager one after the other without any of the other symbols in the catalogue mixed up with them.

Does it matter what type the symbols are? Like whether they are .png or .jpg? Thanks for your response. I thought I was doing that but I will have to check again when I get home.

Loopysue · January 2019

All the graphics files must be png, and if you want them to work as a collection those which belong to the collection must have the same filename with consecutive numbers at the end (01, 02, 03... etc).

Import the graphics using the Symbol Manager "Import PNGs" button, and arrange the imported graphics in the correct order all together within the Symbol Manager. If you have any other images between them, or they are in the wrong order the collection won't work.

Click the first one once, and then hold the SHIFT key down and click the last one, so that all the symbols in the collection (and no others) are selected, then click the Options button.

In the Settings dialog that opens check the box "Symbol is one of a collection", and check both the "Numbers at the end" and "Randomly select from collection" options below that. If you wish there to be random scaling, rotating, reflecting, then use the settings below that, but they are optional so you can leave them at default values if you wish.

Ok that, then make sure that all the symbols you want in the catalogue are selected in the Symbol Manager and click "Save as Catalogue" at the top of the Symbol Manager. It is usual to have the catalogue not far from the folder with the symbols in it somewhere within the Symbols folder. I have a folder called User within the Symbols folder and all my personalised catalogues are located in that parent folder with the symbols in sub-folders within User.

Ok the Symbol Manager and then reopen the catalogue you have just saved. That should do the trick.

Loopysue · January 2019

Its all in the Tome.

Do you have the Tome?

kathorus · January 2019

Posted By: kevbeck43I know how the collections work. I wanted to create one from an .FSC file that I have.

There was supposed to be a question at the end of what I wrote, in my haste to be helpful I forgot to include it, something to the effect of - "Do you see these in your catalog?".

I'd imagine that Loopysue's posts will clear it up.

Loopysue · January 2019

Sorry - never done it that way. I've only ever done it by importing my home-made graphics.

If you have the Tome I am sure its covered in there.

JimP · January 2019

No idea on how to create a collection/random placement either.

I just make up my own symbol sets, particularly for a village or town for a particular nation. So all the villages and towns in that nation have the same symbols available.

Monsen · January 2019

Doesn't matter how you get the symbols into the catalog or what type they are, once you have the symbols you want all nicely collected in the same catalog, it just to set the up as Sue explained above, i.e all symbols must have the exact same name, just with a different number at the end, all symbols must be arranged so they appear as a consecutive group in the symbol manager, and properties must be set as per Sue's screenshot.

Do note that you must NOT "Open" the collection (i.e clicking the small plus) as if you pick a symbol from an opened collection, CC3+ assumes that you want that particular symbol, and not a random pick. (This also means that the option expand all collections must not be enabled). Of course, smart symbol mustn't be disabled either.

kevbeck43 · January 2019

Thanks guys for all of your comments! I really appreciate it. I actually figured all of this out last night fiddling with CC3+ but I am going to bookmark this thread as a reference. Thank you again!

rexalan60 · August 2019

Okay, I have completed all steps as directd. When I open the saved catalogue, it it already opened and I cannot close it. The one symbol I selected will rotate randomly, but the symbol itself does not change. What is wrong?

Monsen · August 2019

If the collection is open by default when you open a catalog, it means that either you have enabled the 'Expand all collections' option (options button at the top of the symbol catalog window), or it isn't a proper collection at all. For it to be a proper collection, all symbols in that collection need to be grouped together next to each other in the symbol catalog, all of them must have the 'Symbol is one of a collection' symbol option set, and all the symbols must have the exact same name, with the exception of a variation at the end determined by the option you chose for the collection. And of course, for the random picking of symbols, all symbols in the collection also need to have the Randomly Select from Collection option set as well.

rexalan60 · August 2019

Monsen,
I must say, your advice has been the most immediately helpful assistance I believe I have ever received in relation to a ProFantasy issue. Issue with creating Random Symbols solved!

Thank you so much. I was about to buy a shotgun, just could not decide what to shoot, computer or my collection of Profantasy products.

Any idea why my City Designer Symbols show up as the dreaded "Red X" when I open them in my CC3+ map?

Monsen · August 2019

Does this happen when you open old maps, or is it when you try to make new maps using CD3? Do you actually have CD3 for CC3+ installed? (Having the CC3 version installed won't help).

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Making symbols in a symbol catalogue place randomly

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