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    • CommentAuthorJensen
    • CommentTimeOct 22nd 2018
     
    Huh, sorry but I missed that. Will have a look on that map
    •  
      CommentAuthorQuenten
    • CommentTimeOct 22nd 2018
     
    Sorry Jensen, I meant Torstan, in Peredur in the Atlas. Got my cities mixed up :(
    • CommentAuthorTexas Jake
    • CommentTimeOct 22nd 2018
     
    Jensen,
    Thanks for the link.
    •  
      CommentAuthorMedio
    • CommentTimeOct 22nd 2018
     
    Great WIP map, keep on doing such a beautiful map.
    • CommentAuthorTexas Jake
    • CommentTimeOct 22nd 2018
     
    Posted By: MedioGreat WIP map, keep on doing such a beautiful map.


    Thank you, Medio. I will keep plugging away.
    • CommentAuthorTexas Jake
    • CommentTimeOct 28th 2018 edited
     
    There was a workers' strike that temporarily shutdown construction in Melekhir. After days of tense negotiation, work has resumed.

    The City of Melekhir CC 9.95x.png
    Finally reached the East Gate.

    The City of Melekhir CC 9.95a.png
    More construction near the Old Market Square.
  1.  
    I have to add my kudos as well. Fascinating techniques and results. Great job.

    I love seeing someone else do such a large map with so many details. I also have used Google maps of some European cities like Rothenburg for inspiration. I did a single block (of Waterdeep) using the same type of techniques you talked about here, but you taking it to such a much larger instance (a city, not just a single block) . And what you have done with the roof lines is something I will come back to the next time I look to do a city.

    Oh, and I really like how you did the contour lines and shading to indicate the hills.
    • CommentAuthorTexas Jake
    • CommentTimeOct 31st 2018 edited
     
    Added more around the East Gate

    The City of Melekhir CC 10.1a.PNG

    The structure just north of the East Gate is the eastern garrison of the town watch. The brown u-shaped structure butted against the north side of the garrison is a stables. The blue structure to the north of that is a tavern. The large brown structure just outside the gate and across the bridge is a stables. The orange building on the north side of the road from it is an inn. The road inside the city walls heading north leads to the Valley Gate.

    My mapping has slowed down a bit as of late. Other tasks have required my time and to some extent I am waiting to catch my second wind. Maybe I should have named the city Marathon. ;)
    •  
      CommentAuthorQuenten
    • CommentTimeOct 31st 2018
     
    Your marathon city looks wonderful, and I will definitely make my next city a better one than my previous - due to your inspiring map.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeNov 1st 2018
     
    I agree with Quenten :)

    Was it a very difficult thing to do to make the background? I think you said you used PS or GIMP, but cant remember right now. I am starting to think that others might like to know how you did it if you could adapt it to GIMP - which is quite often used by CC3ers for things like this, and for making new symbols. Its kind of the unofficial-official bitmap editor for us because its used in many of the Tome exercises where a bitmap editor is required for stuff like making new city symbols, so quite a few CC3ers are more familiar with it than might be thought at a glance.

    Do you think a GIMP newbie might be able to follow a set of straightforward instructions to create something like that for themselves?
  2.  
    Quenten,
    I am glad the map has been of benefit to you. I know that I have learned and been inspired a great deal by viewing the works of others and by their tutorials. It is my intent to pass on what I can of what I've learned.

    Sue,
    I did the background in SketchBook which has been made free for download by Autodesk. Sometimes I take the work I do in SketchBook and tweak it it PS. For drawing I prefer SektchBook to PS. I don't have any experience with GIMP. The background is three or four different (if I remember right) parchment layers as a base. I tweaked the order and interaction of the layers to find what I liked best. I looked for tone and texture. Then I drew the linework on a separate layer. I initialy laid out the hills by drawing contour lines on a separate layer. I added different color for each contour. Once I had the hills drawn and colored in like I liked, I shaded and highlighted on separate layers to created depth. Shade was a multiply layer and highlight an overlay layer. Another note. I initially laid out the rivers in CC3+ and saved to a PNG. I used this as a guided in SketchBook when doing the background. If you look at the thread on Cartographers Guild (I reference the thread at the top of this thread) you get a small glimpse of this process as I worked it out.
  3.  
    Thought I would post a wide view of the city. Still quite a bit to go. Entity count is up to 293,661 occupying 20102.73 K of memory.
      The City of Melekhir CC 10.15.png
    • CommentAuthorLorelei
    • CommentTimeNov 1st 2018
     
    Wow. This is fantastic. Just fantastic.
  4.  
    Thank you, Lorelei. It has been a learning experience. My stylistic preferences have changed as I have progressed (such as ridge line widths for example) which has led to subtle differences in different sections of the city. I like the differences because the suggest an ongoing evolution of the city as it grows. I removed the port on the west bank across from the palace area and will eventually be reinserting it. It still survives in a previous save.
  5.  
    Here is a shot that shows the port before it was wiped out by a digital hurricane. You can also see a fishing village on the peninsula. The houses to the north of the port were laid out with the random street tool. In fact, at one point much of the city was mapped with the random street tool. It was fun laying down houses with the tool and watching large areas get populated quickly, but I wasn't capturing the look of a typical walled medieval city. I didn't realize this until someone else made a comment. Their comment enabled me to look at what I had done and see it more clearly. I had interpreted what I had seen in historic maps and filtered it through my modern American conception of what a neighborhood looked like. I was doing this and didn't even realize it. I cannot stress enough the importance of having another set of eyes look at your work—whether it is writing or mapping.
      The City of Melekhir with port.png
  6.  
    Added some more to the east of the Old Market Square. Moving into the area where the three ponds are and transitioning to less dense and more field area. The brown structure across the road from the pond and just south of the orange complex with the enclosed courtyard is a granary. This area of the city was once a marsh. It was drained during the reign of King Melek and converted to farmland that was used by the Academy to research improved farming techniques.
      The City of Melekhir CC 10.20B Districts.png
    • CommentAuthorTexas Jake
    • CommentTimeNov 4th 2018 edited
     
    I am approaching the wall. CC3+ is sputtering sometimes when it redraws. Last time I hit this I deleted all the buildings in the vicinity of the major port on the west bank. This helped, but now I am closing in on that wall again. I took Sue's advice and started moving buildings to separate district layers. I have many of the buildings turn-off via layers, but with limited effect. I am determined to finish this map and I will. Any suggestions on how to work around this wall would be appreciated (at the moment I have members of the city watch working on a tunnel under it).


    Here is a count of all entities.
    List Count.PNG


    Here is a shot of the entire map area with sheet effects off. You can see how I did the river contour. It is a black layer set to an opacity of 12%. Many of the houses have been put in cloaking mode. City residents in these areas are complaining and there have been numerous reports of injuries caused by people walking into structures they cannot see. City leaders are trying to quell the angered mobs.
    The City of Melekhir CC 10.20B Overview.png

    Edit: just discovered I had two instances of CC3+ running in the background (for a total of three). This certainly has not helped my problem. I will have to report back when I have enough time to see how the shutdown districts have helped things without the overhead of triple redundancy.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeNov 4th 2018
     
    Daaaam!

    I'd be lucky to have just one instance open with a city half that size :P

    I think you will find that it runs considerably better when its only working 1/3 as hard as it was ;)

    I currently have too many apps open for the images to load properly on this thread, but having seen your progress before I am certain that once I finish working today and shut everything else I will be in for a treat :)
    • CommentAuthorTexas Jake
    • CommentTimeNov 4th 2018 edited
     
    Still experiencing some lag during some of the redraws. I will restart my computer later and see if that helps. I don't think the two extra instances of CC3+ had as big an effect as you might think since they were idle. Didn't notice a drastic difference once they were shut down.

    BTW, I am eager to get my hands on the new style you just finished, Sue. The 2018 Annual is next on my purchase list.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeNov 4th 2018
     
    CC3+ requires contiguous memory (something I was told only recently), so if you've had a lot of things open that will probably help quite a lot.

    Thanks :) There will hopefully be a few domes to come at some point ;) You can make most things with the House command, but anything with a variable concave or convex pitch is really quite time consuming to draw unless you have the symbols to paste them where required. They may only be of limited use, but I'm hoping they will be better than nothing.
  7.  
    I am eager to take it for a test drive.

    I have 8 gig of RAM, so I think even with 3 instances open, CC3+ probably had access to just about all the memory it can make use of. Not sure how hard it was pushing my CPU. I have a i7 950 which is a cast-off from my son and is about six years old. Right now CC3+ is eating up about 2 gig if I am interpreting the list all correctly. I believe it can access up to 4 gig with Widows 10 64 bit, which is what I am running. I think the redistricting helped, but not as much as I had hoped for. I am curious if there is a hard limit for entities.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeNov 4th 2018
     
    Ummm.

    I think CC3 only ever uses about 4GB RAM, and maybe 2 processors?

    (not sure about those figures)

    It may be that you need to consider hiding more of those layer districts (making smaller districts and having most of them switched off) and switching off all the effects unless you are about to render?
    • CommentAuthorjslayton
    • CommentTimeNov 4th 2018 edited
     
    There is not a hard limit for the number of entities in a drawing, but there are practical limits that will probably cause problems at around a few hundred thousand entities. If your CC3+ starts to behave oddly, I recommend saving your current drawing to a new file and restarting CC3+. This kind of restart can improve performance somewhat when editing a map because reduces memory fragmentation in the process address space.

    The speed of a redraw is affected by the number of entities in your map, the kinds of fill styles, and the number and kinds of effects in use. Effects with blurs (like drop shadows) can kill redraw time. Fill styles with rotated bitmaps can cause performance issues if there are many different angles because the system internally generates and caches a new bitmap for each combination of bitmap and rotation angle. The single worst performance-killer that I've seen is high-density rotated hatch fills because they can lead to drawing literally hundreds of thousands of individual drawing elements for just a few map entities.

    The effects drawing code can access all of the processor cores on your system, but the main code that handles the drawing list is single-threaded (it can only use one processor core at a time).

    Each instance of CC3+ can access its own 4GB memory area when run on a 64-bit OS version, or 2GB on a 32-bit OS version. If an instance of CC3+ isn't actively redrawing and if you're not moving the mouse cursor over it, then it shouldn't be using any processor power.
  8.  
    Thanks for the response jslayton. Once I get settled into an area and won't be moving around much I tend to go with effects on. I know this pushes the system and the software, but with how I'm mapping I want to see the actual road edges after effects. If I am placing roads after laying down buildings (which I often do) this is less critical.
    • CommentAuthorTexas Jake
    • CommentTimeNov 5th 2018 edited
     
    Working on mapping the area along the east wall.
    The City of Melekhir CC 10.30R.png
    The blue building in the SE corner is a tavern. It is frequented by the soldiers of the garrison. The buildings in the vicinity of the inn are merchants that make their living selling their wares primarily to the soldiers. There is a small barracks for the town watch in the orange structures butted against the city wall. The flat-roofed three tiered structure to the south of the westernmost field with the pond is an annex of the Royal Academy. The building on the edge of the pond is a pumping station. It can pump water out of the pound and also water (from a shallow well) into the pond. I used the Adjust Hue/Saturation (AH/S) effect to make the fields different. There are now three sheets for fields: a standard sheet, another sheet with +12% across the board (AH/S), and another for fallow fields that is -12% across the board. Thank you Remy for your article in the 9 October ProFantasy blog that explains this technique. I will be going through the map and assigning field to these sheets.
    • CommentAuthorJensen
    • CommentTimeNov 5th 2018
     
    This city really comes alive! very great!
  9.  
    Thank you, Jensen. I am still learning about this CC3+ program and all this neat little things you can do with it.
    • CommentAuthorJensen
    • CommentTimeNov 5th 2018
     
    Yeah, me too, that’s part of the fun for me. CC3 is a small universe in itself, a world to explore - as your city is.
  10.  
    Slowly filling in the area along the eastern wall.
      The City of Melekhir CC 10.37.png
  11.  
    Applied the AH/S trick to some housing. I like the variation.
      The City of Melekhir CC 10.37a.png
    •  
      CommentAuthorQuenten
    • CommentTimeNov 6th 2018
     
    What do you mean by the AH/S trick? BTW, your city grows more glorious each day
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeNov 7th 2018
     
    Quite possibly an HSL sheet effect?

    Can't think of a better way of varying the colour of some of the rooftops.

    I love this city! :)
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeNov 7th 2018
     
    I have a question (the reason for which will seem a bit obscure right now, but become totally obvious a few weeks down the line)

    Are you using the default CD3B House styles, or are you designing your own? I can't really tell at this scale. I've pasted a few on a map of my own, but I think you may have simplified the style by removing the ridges to keep the poly count down?
  12.  
    Quenten,
    AH/S is my abbreviation for Adjust Hue/Saturation. I declared the abbreviate two post upstream, but that kind of stuff is easily missed.

    Sue,
    Some of the houses are my own variations. I also play around with settings at time on the fly, especially the ridge lines. I use the trapezoid (9) setting on house shape often to give me better control when butting structures. Many of the houses are a combination of pieces manually placed.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeNov 7th 2018
     
    Thank you :)

    And I'm sorry - I'm probably to blame for the wrong acronym I bandy about when talking about the AH/S effect. It takes a conscious effort to find the forward slash character on my laptop keyboard, and I'm afraid that over time I've forgotten that the acronym I use (HSL sheet effect) isn't actually correct but only a way of referring to the three variables it adjusts (Hue, Saturation, and Lightness) ;)
  13.  
    I figured we were talking about the same thing.
  14.  
    Sue,
    Removing the ridges was a stylistic choice. I hadn't even thought about it in the context of reducing overhead.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeNov 7th 2018
     
    It works well for both reasons - less visually cluttered, and also less overhead. Each of those ridges adds another 4 nodes at the very least, so in a large city that soon adds up to a very large proportion of all the nodes in the map. If there is a ridge for every roof part then just removing them can halve the node count.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeNov 7th 2018
     
    However, I've never yet worked out a way to get rid of them once they are there, so its good to plan ahead the way you have done and make a decision to alter the styles to zero that particular variable if you think you may have a problem with memory later on once the city is more than half built.
  15.  
    Sue,
    There has been no planning concernning conserving resources on my part in relation to this map. It has been more stumbling forward as I go. ;) I didn't anticipate the size of this project when I started.

    I checked task manager yesterday when CC3 starting to hiccup during a refresh and it is indicating the CPU is maxing out and memory is fine. Makes me curious to find out how a new cpu and motherboard will impact the situation.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeNov 7th 2018
     
    I'm the wrong person to know the answer to that one.

    I have a very broken 4GB RAM 2 processor laptop that crashes if I do more than mess around with a handful of symbols. This is nothing to do with PF software at all, but is the result of the infamous 'Creator's Update' of Windows 10 about 14 months ago (which I only found out after the fact was incompatible with my computer) and the processor security upgrades at the beginning of 2018.

    So you'll have to tell me how it goes ;)
  16.  
    Hopefully you will be able to replace that laptop soon.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTimeNov 7th 2018
     
    Thanks :)

    Its not worrying me so much these days.
  17.  
    Here is the latest update.
      The City of Melekhir CC 10.40C.png
    •  
      CommentAuthorQuenten
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    The detail is amazing - especially love the boathouse (?) by the lake, with its little balcony. I am in love with your city.
  18.  
    Thanks Quenten.

    That is a pumping station that can pump water out of the pond into the other two ponds. It also can pump water into the pond from a shallow well beneath the structure.
  19.  
    Resized the livestock. They were ginormous before I put them on the treadmill.
      The City of Melekhir CC 10.40dr.png
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    There must be hundreds of stories in this city by now ;)
  20.  
    Undoubtedly.
  21.  
    Here is a wide shot of the city.
      The City of Melekhir CC 10.40OV.png