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    • CommentAuthorTonnichiwa
    • CommentTimeJan 11th 2018
     
    Hi everyone,

    This month at the Cartographer's Guild I entered the lite competition to map someplace or something in our hometown. At first I was going to do a fantasy version of my RV but decided to go bigger and do a fantasy version of my hometown. So this is it. The fantasy version of Ocean Shores.

    Enjoy
      Fantasy Ocean Shores.JPG
    • CommentAuthorLorelei
    • CommentTimeJan 11th 2018
     
    Tony, this is great. The blur effect you used on the eastern shore is fantastic! I can SEE the dip of the oceans floor....however....is the land actually green? I would think there is some kind of a sandy shore there - so I trace the coast and add a bit of a shore on each side in a sandy color with a fade edge effect. Otherwise, I wouldn't change a thing, its wonderful.
    • CommentAuthorTonnichiwa
    • CommentTime7 days ago edited
     
    Thanks Lorelie. It is green when the tide comes in. When it goes out faaar away from the city, then it turns sandy. The sand doesn't start until you get way away from the city. I'm not quite sure why that is, this is a weird place. All of the pictures I see of it online are always with the tide out and in the summertime when it isn't poring down rain. So then it looks sandy. In the winter though, it doesn't snow. And when the water comes right up over whatever that green/brown stuff is on the beach, then to me, the whole beach looks green. But I guess I could try putting a patch of sand in there and see if I can get things to work better.

    On the other side, it is green all the time as the water is actually a harbor and that side never changes. It goes right up over a bunch of plants and muck and other stuff and always looks weird. Even when you look at it on google earth, it has a weird green effect to it.
    • CommentAuthorLorelei
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    Well don't change it if it's really green....I just found it odd....but then again, i'm on the Atlantic Coast where all the shoreline is sandy :) Are you in the Pacific Northwest? Where is this Ocean Shores?
    • CommentAuthorTonnichiwa
    • CommentTime7 days ago edited
     
    Yeah, I'm in the pacific northwest. I live on the most west coast you can get to in the lower 48. There is sand out there but it looks nothing like most of the white beaches around the world. It is more of a dingy brown type sand, or a granite gray colored sand.

    Oh, I just realized, I forgot to put trees on the ocean side. I'll have to fix that. Well, more like bushes really.
    • CommentAuthorScottA
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    Looks really nice, and I also really like that fade into the ocean. My only quibble would be the waves on the western shore. They're too perfect and straight, like tracks. I think breaking them up would look better.
  1.  
    So this would be the town with the tree line. Which one do you like better?
      Fantasy Ocean Shores.PNG
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    Those waves.... Hmmm...

    They are incredibly hard-edged.

    How about replacing them with hand drawn lines of white on a separate sheet, and a very slight blur effect? A bit like the waves in my MC map. I think I left them in on that MC ocean file I uploaded just recently?
  2.  
    Thanks ScottA. It was the only way I could think of to represent waves at the time.

    Thanks Sue! I'd forgotten about that! Now I'm going to have to change it up to just like you said!

    What do you guys think of the thin line of trees?
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    I'm undecided about them. They look smaller than the rest of the trees, which feels a bit odd.

    I assure you, though, that I do have some very funny ideas about keeping overland symbols the same relative size (except for mountains) :P You will probably be quite safe ignoring me.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    Try putting one of those wave lines right on the edge of the water. I find that although water is transparent its more convincing if there's just a very thin suggestion, barely visible, of the edge of its extent. Whether its sand/mud/plant growth, most things look darker when they are wet, which is why I also didn't fade the water out to nothing. I think I went from 100% in the middle to about 30% at the edge? Can't remember without looking!
  3.  
    Thanks Sue, Yeah, those symbols are smaller because the trees that are near the ocean are the exact same kind found around the rest of ocean shores, but they are smaller. I think it has something to do with those trees using saltwater from the ocean instead of the freshwater that the rest of the trees more inland dig down for. All I know is that it is very weird to look at in real life.

    I'll try that thin line and see what it does. I'm going to use a real picture from google earth and try to recreate those waves a bit.

    Thanks again for your help with oceans :)
    • CommentAuthorScottA
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    Everything seems to be in rigid lines -- waves, walls, buildings, trees. Walls and buildings are man-made and follow streets, but natural things tend to be very random, so maybe randomizing some of the elements a bit would be good, too.

    Also, I like that font but it is hard to read. Maybe the size could be increased a bit?
    • CommentAuthorTonnichiwa
    • CommentTime7 days ago edited
     
    @ ScottA: Well, my town is on a very thin peninsula and you should go look at it on google earth. You will see that the randomness of the trees is just about right for the town. The town also doesn't really look anything like my map does, because I only did the center of town and had to make it look a little more fantasy. From a top down view you can see that everything goes in almost straight lines right down the peninsula. It is almost a completely manicured looking town from the air. The funny thing is, when you are driving through town you can't see near as many of the houses as trees are in the way all over the place and it looks sort of chaotic. But I think it was designed to look that way. It is the only place I've seen where the trees and bushes look all chaotic when you are really looking at them but have a sort of order when looked at from the air. But I will try to randomize it a bit more on the forest near the ocean.

    But the pictures they have on google earth were taken this summer during the day when the tide was out and you can see all of the vehicles on the beach and the waves crashing in long lines down the beach. It is really interesting to look at if you get close enough. There are canals running all through the southern part of the town too. That is the part I didn't map.

    The text actually looks really good on the guild website. I think it is just because we can only upload 1.90 MB files here as to the text being unreadable.

    Anyway, here is a different set of waves added. I tried to make them look sort of like they do on google earth but I'm having a bit of issue with the blur. But I think the blur is good enough for this.

    What do you guys think?
      Fantasy Ocean Shores2.PNG
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    The blur looks good - a lot better than the symbols

    I would add another sheet with only about half the blur and draw a very fine line along the water's edge, and maybe just a dash of a line here and there along the crests of the waves?

    Something to give it just a tad more focus :)
  4.  
    Ok. I did draw one line across the waters edge. The blur made it disappear so I had to make it bigger. With this new one I hope it makes things look just perfect. Thank you Sue :)
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    Don't forget the other water's edge on the other side of the land ;)
  5.  
    Haha, ok Sue, I didn't forget. But I changed the treeline as ScottA suggested too. Then something happened. I realized that with such a small area, no matter what I did it seemed the trees would sort of end up in a pattern. So instead, I went looking for a fill style that might help. Then I ran across the Herwin Weilink scrubland fill style. I figured it was worth a shot. It turns out that the scrub fill looks much better I think and sort of gives it that beach feel.

    So how's this one look?
      Fantasy Ocean Shores2.JPG
    • CommentAuthorScottA
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    Oh, well, I was just offering suggestions. My opinions don't really mean anything! lol! Especially when you have the Maestra offering her brilliant tutelage! Soak it up, she has so much to share!
  6.  
    Lol, well ScottA you were right. they did look too much like a pattern and I didn't necessarily like it but I needed something to represent scrubrush so the closest thing I could think of was trees. Then I remembered we had the fill style for that with little scrub brush all over it. I think it improved the look of the map. Thank you for your suggestion :) Without it I would have just settled on the trees.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTime7 days ago edited
     
    Maestro?

    LOL! Don't mind me. I'm just a very opinionated person ;)

    You all know better than to take me too seriously :P

    (and here comes another one!)

    Perhaps try taking that water's edge blur down a few more notches, but otherwise a thousand times better than the original :)
  7.  
    It's already at 1. I tried .5 but I saw no difference. And thank you.

    Next, I'm going to upload some close up pictures of some of the buildings that I built for this. Virtually every building was made in Perspectives 3. The castle was first drawn in Perspectives 3, then the Herwin Weilink Isometric Dungeon wall symbols were put on it to give it that great looking giant brick/rock look. Then the doors for the keep are from the Temple of Bones set. The buildings have been given little tidbits to make them stand out from the buildings I've made in the past so these look a bit better.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    Oh, right....

    I think that's why I work with larger base maps - about 5000 map units square. That way, although you have to use large numbers to get a decent edge fade, you can do much finer adjustments at the smaller end of the scale. For example, on one of my maps that blur would have been at least 50, leaving me with the option of reducing it by half several times over.

    I keep forgetting that everyone works much smaller than I do!
    • CommentAuthorTonnichiwa
    • CommentTime7 days ago edited
     
    I would work much larger except for one thing. I truly suck at maths. So making a map that large would mean tons of math for me to convert every symbol to the larger map and I really don't know if my brain would be able to function after attempting something like that.

    I'm sure it is a chore normally but I couldn't even imagine trying to attempt something like that with perspectives 3!
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    I have to admit that I haven't even opened that particular birthday present yet!

    I've been too busy doing other stuff.

    Are you going to make a set of ISO building symbols? I think they might be really popular. Several times, both here and over at the Guild, people have asked if there are any ISO city sets and so on.
  8.  
    Funny you should ask Sue, Here we go, the start of five new iso buildings that I used in my map.

    First, the regular tudor house that I've made and everyone knows.
      Tudor House .JPG
    •  
      CommentAuthorMonsen
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    Posted By: LoopysueI think that's why I work with larger base maps - about 5000 map units square. That way, although you have to use large numbers to get a decent edge fade, you can do much finer adjustments at the smaller end of the scale.
    For making actual maps, this is actually bad advice. The size should always be correct depending on the "real world" size of the place you are mapping. Anything else means that all information from CC3+ (coordinates, lengths, distances, etc) is wrong. All distances in effects support decimal numbers, so there is no good reason to artificially increase map size to get precision, it is just as easy to halve the number 1 as the number 50. It is also easier to set the right effect number from the start, because if you need a 1-foot edge fade in a city map (imperial scale), the size of the edge fade would be 1, since that too follows the map units.
  9.  
    Next, A tudor style manse.
      Whole Manse.JPG
  10.  
    Next, a Tudor Style Tavern
      Whole Tavern.JPG
    • CommentAuthorTonnichiwa
    • CommentTime7 days ago edited
     
    Next a Tudor style Coaching Inn ( I was recently informed on the CC3+ facebook group that a coaching inn is 260 feet wide. If only I had known I would have made it that size.)
      Whole Coaching Inn.JPG
  11.  
    A little closer up on the door
      Front of Coaching Inn.JPG
  12.  
    And lastly, A blacksmith
      Whole Blacksmith.JPG
    • CommentAuthorTonnichiwa
    • CommentTime7 days ago edited
     
    These are now made into PNG's. I've made them available over on the Cartographer's Guild under the Mapping Elements thread.
    •  
      CommentAuthorMonsen
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    Very nice. I like these, both as individual houses, and as used in the map.

    I'm not to fond of the city wall though, I think the fill looks to busy at this scale, detracting from the overall map.
    • CommentAuthorTonnichiwa
    • CommentTime7 days ago edited
     
    Yeah, I think you're right. The only reason I don't change it is because I only have three days left on the competition and I can't build another castle to replace it in that time. Otherwise I would make one a little less busy. And I'm glad to hear you like the buildings. Thank you :)
    • CommentAuthorTonnichiwa
    • CommentTime7 days ago edited
     
    So here are some close ups of the buildings around town.
      Blacksmith around town.JPG
      Coaching Inn around town.JPG
      Manse around town.JPG
      Tavern around town.JPG
      Tudor Houses around town.JPG
    • CommentAuthorLorelei
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    Like, Sue, sometimes I tend to map "large" too and size according to my eye, not the scale of the map itself. Bad, I know, but it's art.....and I don't do good maths either :) It took me longer than i'd like to admit how to figure out my battle maps sizes to print correctly on posters :) The Atlas is good practice for me to stay within the "guidelines" lol

    Tony, these symbols are great!! I would buy a set! Also, I like the scrub fill better than the trees. All in all, a pretty great map!
    •  
      CommentAuthorMonsen
    • CommentTime7 days ago edited
     
    Posted By: LoreleiIt took me longer than i'd like to admit how to figure out my battle maps sizes to print correctly on posters
    This is one of the advantages of using the proper scale. It makes correct printing and exporting MUCH simpler (and require much less math). And of course, all symbols are by default scaled correctly (this is especially true for battlemap-level maps, where things have proper sizes, on overland maps symbol scale is used much more variably), so as long as you stick to a correct scale, all symbols are also correct out of the box.
    • CommentAuthorScottA
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    The Maestra comment wasn't snark, Sue, I think your work is amazing and really appreciate any and all comments and advice!!!

    Tonnichiwa, love the buildings! I'm going to have to go over to CG and check them out.
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    Oh no, I realised that, Scott. Don't worry.

    And thank you for the compliment.

    I just hope that you realise I'm not actually an expert in anything, except being a bit of a rebel, and for that reason its always best to take all advice into consideration - not just mine :P

    @Tony - those are wonderful buildings. Thanks very much :)
  13.  
    @ Lorelei: Thanks! I am very glad you like them :)

    @ ScottA: Thanks!, hopefully you can make some awesome maps with them!

    @ Loopysue: Thanks!, so were you one of those people you talked about over on the guild? :P
    • CommentAuthorLoopysue
    • CommentTime7 days ago
     
    I might be ;)
    • CommentAuthorTonnichiwa
    • CommentTime6 days ago edited
     
    Ok, so a sneek peak at another building I'm trying to figure out. It is just in a concept stage right now so I still have to make sure all the windows are in the right place and I have to try to figure out how to get a good looking roof for the place, but here it is.

    A Tudor style Theatre!
      Tudor Theatre.JPG
  14.  
    Freakin' Awesome!
    • CommentAuthorJimP
    • CommentTime6 days ago
     
    Weren't those theaters a ring ? Hollow center ? That was referred to as The Pit. The one penny patrons stood and the ring is where the seated customers were ? Or do I have wrong century ?
    • CommentAuthorTonnichiwa
    • CommentTime6 days ago edited
     
    Honestly, I don't really know Jim. I've never studied them. I was just trying to copy a photograph of one I've seen online. It has a thatched roof over the top of it but I'm having quite a hard time making a roof that looks anything like it in perspectives 3.

    @ Dennis Landi: Thanks :)
    •  
      CommentAuthorQuenten
    • CommentTime6 days ago
     
    The Globe in London, modelled on Shakespeare's Globe, is a 'ring' theatre as Jim described. My wife and I recently saw Falstaff there, and we were lucky to get a seat under cover of the ring; in the centre was the stage (covered) with the props and theatre rooms behind it. In front is an open space where you can stand only - the the poor people there got wet during Act II when London's weather intervened. Basically. Jim is correct, and it still applies - a roof covering only the circumferential area, and the stage itself.
    • CommentAuthorTonnichiwa
    • CommentTime6 days ago edited
     
    Hmm interesting. I certainly hope you guys had a great time watching that play!

    Well, just so you guys know, what you see in the center is just filled space that Perspectives does for you. It isn't an actual roof. This is after all, just a sneek peak at the building I'm working on. It is in the concept stage right now until I can find out more about what it should look like from this angle. This may end up not being a feasible building at all if I can't find a good way to build it.
    •  
      CommentAuthorQuenten
    • CommentTime6 days ago
     
    Would making it octagonal help with the roofs?
    • CommentAuthorTonnichiwa
    • CommentTime6 days ago edited
     
    I'm not really sure. It might but it looks like there are more sides to it than just eight. I might have to drag it into Gimp and draw the ringed thatched roof myself. That would probably be the smart thing to do.