Large map (contintent-sized): CC3 or Fracal Terrain?

Hi,

I am a brand new user of Campaign Cartographer who is a bit uncertain as to whether she picked the right software for the job, or if perhaps Fractal Terrains would have been more appropriate. What I am looking to do is to create a fairly large overview map of a fantasy world. It doesn't necessarily have to be a whole globe to start with, but at least a large continent. I have tried out CC3+ for a week or so now and my main problem has been coming to grasp to what sort of scale I am working with. I made the map 5000 by 5000, but I am not sure what my scale is, as such, so it makes it hard to envision just how large a section of land the map is actually representing.

Well, as you can see, I am a bit lost on some of the core concepts. I have been trying to make my way through the documenation, but so far it is all a bit nebulous. This is my first time working with any kind of CAD software, as well.

In terms of Fractal Terrain, some of how it is described sounds quite ideal, but just how difficult is it to create a world from scratch with it? And how does it work when you export a section to CC3?

Comments

  • I don't have fractal terrains yet, only cc3+. I've been using g it since February, so I can tell you so.e of the things I've learned.

    Both programs can make maps on a global scale. I'm actually working on a continental map for a commission that is on a rather large scale. I'm also working on a world map for a campaign I will be run into in the coming months. There is an artist here on the forums, LoopySue, that does use fractal terrains, doing so.e amazing work with global and city maps with it. So if you look at some of the show and tell threads from her, myself, Lorelei... And well there are a lot of us that make overland maps....you can get a feel for what either program can do.

    There is another edition you can purchase, and it's WELL worth the small investment, and that's the Tome if Ultimate Mapping. It's currently available for cc3, so it won't integrate into cc3+, but the information in it is extremely helpful, once you have the basics down. I also believe there are plans to upgrade it to cc3+ but that takes time.

    As for how well fractal terrains will import into cc3+, the answer would be very well. Profantasy designs all of their programs to work in conjunction with each other. From what I can tell with the programs I do have, they work together mostly seamlessly.

    It really boils down to a matter of taste. And that, unfortunately, only you can decide. But please feel free to look at the show and tell threads here in the forums. Most of us that post here are customers, just like you. We were all new once :-). You will see a lot of what these programs have to offer.

    Hope this helps!
  • I have used CC3 and FT3 both for making planets.
  • MonsenMonsen Administrator 🖼️ 46 images Cartographer
    FT is designed to create semi-realistic planets. It is great for whole planetary maps, especially for random generated ones.
    If you want to create a continent map, perhaps throw in some borders, labels, large cities and symbols, the tool for the job is CC3+

    Exporting from FT3 to CC3 works quite well though, so it can be a big advantage making the main planetary map in FT3 and export the required section for further processing in CC3. There should eb a demo version of FT3 available, so you can try out it's editing functions. Be aware that it is VERY different from CC3+ though.

    You say you don't know what your scale is. I recommend you sit down and think about your scale a bit before you start mapping at all. Look at some real-world maps to get a sense of how big things are, and then decide on a proper scale for your map. Starting without a scale in mind is just asking for trouble as your map progresses.
  • LoopysueLoopysue ProFantasy 🖼️ 39 images Cartographer
    I use FT3 to generate more believable coastlines for my CC3 maps. Monsen is right about it being very different, though ;)
  • DogtagDogtag Moderator, Betatester Traveler
    edited September 2016
    Here are some continent- or world-sized maps done in CC3/CC3+. Some may or may not have been exported from Fractal Terrains but they were detailed in CC3 or CC3+. Note that some use styles available to CC3 via a subscription to the Cartographer's Annual and that the styles may not yet be available for CC3+. ProFantasy is working to convert the annuals for CC3+. The first two maps, for example, use the "13th Age" style from one of the annuals.

    http://forum.profantasy.com/comments.php?DiscussionID=5937
    http://forum.profantasy.com/comments.php?DiscussionID=5189
    http://forum.profantasy.com/comments.php?DiscussionID=4878&page=1#Item_4
    http://forum.profantasy.com/comments.php?DiscussionID=4343
    http://forum.profantasy.com/comments.php?DiscussionID=4199

    Cheers,
    ~Dogtag
  • Thanks for the feedback! I should clarify that the issue I am having with scale is what settings control it and how (if at all) it relates to the size I choose for the image. Is the scale always fixed so that the only way to represent large distances is to have a very large map or can you have a smaller scale and thus get by with a smaller map?

    I will grab the Fractal Designs demo and play around with it for a bit as well, see if it might be useful to have that too. I am not (at least not so far, anyway) primarily concerned with the aesthetics of the map as its to aid world-building for a book rather than for publication. But then again, if that goes anywhere its always nice to have a nice map!
  • MonsenMonsen Administrator 🖼️ 46 images Cartographer
    edited September 2016
    Posted By: LindaIs the scale always fixed so that the only way to represent large distances is to have a very large map or can you have a smaller scale and thus get by with a smaller map?
    Scale is measured in an internal value called Map Units. The definition of a map unit depends on the type of map, in overland maps these represents miles (or km for metric maps). While the program doesn't enforce this, you should always keep to this scale, it makes everything much simpler. The actual size of the map doesn't really matter anyway, working on a 5 by 5 map or a 5000 by 5000 map doesn't make any real difference, it doesn't affect file size or memory use in any way, so there is no reason not to follow default scale, not doing so only nets you problems in the long run with no benefits.
    So if your continent is 20000 by 14000 miles, make a map 20000x14000. Note that whatever the size, this doesn't affect rendering it to an image file later.
  • Ah hah! Thank you, that explanation makes sense. It was a little hard (at least for me) to reach that conclusion from the documentation.

    I don't suppose a map can be resized once made?
  • MonsenMonsen Administrator 🖼️ 46 images Cartographer
    Posted By: LindaI don't suppose a map can be resized once made?
    Not a problem. You have the Scale command (Button in the left toolbars) that can scale anything, including the map border and the entire map. In CC3(+), your workspace isn't really limited, what happens is that your map borders are drawn in the sizes you specify in the new map wizard, and most drawing tools will only draw inside the map border, but in reality, you have all the space outside it too, and the map border can be expanded into this area. If you go for this, make sure to scale everything on the map border and screen sheets though, or you may experience some strangeness.

    Or, you can create a new map, then just use regular clipboard copy to copy entities from your old map to a new map (and optionally scale them if required). This is usually easier.
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