How to Edit the Forest tool.
rman88
Newcomer
hey, i kinda have a bit of a question thats been bugging me. you see i like to get very detailed in my map making. so detailed that i end up placing every tree by hand. something that is quite tedious and time consuming. but i noticed you had a forest tool. a tool that allows me to make a contor like area where it will automatically place trees. only problem with this is that i cannot edit the size of the trees. so they end up being far far to big. i also cannot edit what is inside of the woods. as i like to have a larger mix of trees including dead, half dead, and fruit trees.
so in short hear are my questions.
1 how do you edit the size of the trees the tool makes. as for the life of me i cannot figure out how to do that.
2 how do you edit what it spawns. or is that even possible?
also i might as well show you how far i got on the map. it kinda took me about a month of on an off work.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/fwxmqn40ybvkp4v/North Vs South.JPG?dl=0
so in short hear are my questions.
1 how do you edit the size of the trees the tool makes. as for the life of me i cannot figure out how to do that.
2 how do you edit what it spawns. or is that even possible?
also i might as well show you how far i got on the map. it kinda took me about a month of on an off work.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/fwxmqn40ybvkp4v/North Vs South.JPG?dl=0
Comments
1. Can macro tools be copied and customized like regular tools? I presume yes.
2. Is the macro saved with the tool, or does the tool call a macro from the FCW32.mac file?
3. Can the symbols be changed by editing the macro?
4. Is there a macro command for scaling symbols?
a) the tool itself (dto file)
b) the macro (dtm file)
c) a preview drawing, that displays the tool visually (FCW)
Look at /System/Drawtools/Overland Mike Schley/Terrain Default, Forest Decid.* for an example.
2. It is saved separately (see above), though longer macros should probably better be saved in FCW32.mac (the macro file) and just be called from the drawing tool macro.
3./4. The macro just calls the forest setting changes the selection method (so the user doesn't have to select anything), and then calls the "Fill with Symbols" (FOREST) command.
This is the macro from the example above:
FORESTLOAD @system\fillers\CC3_MikeSchley_Deciduous.FIL
SELSAVE
SELBYP
FOREST
SELREST
Basically the tool itself allows you to draw a smooth polygon, then the macro is run afterwards which uses FOREST to fill the just drawn area with forest symbols.
The symbols used and their scale is set in the forest setting. See "Draw > Fill with Symbols..." and "Load" the setting CC3_MikeSchley_Deciduous.FIL to see it in action.
The field at the top points to the symbol catalog that contains all the symbols used for the forest. Opening and scaling these symbols will change the scale of the forest (i highly recommend to make a backup copy before messing with these). Below is the specific list of symbol used for this forest tool.
As to how the process works, imagine the forest area to be filled as a grid of squares with one square being a "Unit" (the Unit size in the settings defines how large such a unit is on the map. The CX and CY in the symbol list tells CC3+ how large the symbol is in "units". The algorithm will start with the largest pieces and try to fill up the area as well as possible, then move to the next smaller piece, and so on until the forest area is filled. Then it will use the pieces marked as "single" to form the edges of the forest.
You see, the forest tool is quite complicated! But it can be manipulated in many different ways and can potentially be used to fill areas with all kinds of symbols.
At least you did it at the end of the week.
That's a lot to chew over and eventually experiment with! Once the gray matter in my skull stops spinning.
Cheers,
~Dogtag
Also, the Tome of Ultimate Mapping has detailed information about macros. It's another purchase but if you want to get the most out of the Profantasy software library, I highly recommend it. It has information on pretty much everything and includes tips, tricks, and tutorials.
I hope that helps.
Cheers,
~Dogtag
To use the forest tool itself you don't need to think about the drawing tool macro at all though, you can just use it straight from the forest options dialog. When you go to Draw -> Fill with symbols you get the forest options dialog which is where all the configuration lies (Ralf mentioned this earlier). From this dialog you can save the settings you make to be able to call them from a macro, but you can also skip the macro part completely and just click the Run Now button instead. This will prompt you to select the entities to be filled with the tool directly, without bothering with any macros. Just make sure to have an appropriate entity to be filled drawn before using the command.
To draw a filled forest via menu command (instead of a macro-enabled drawing tool):
- Choose the color you want for the background of the forest.
- Manually select the correct sheet and layer by clicking the corresponding fields in the status bar and picking them from their respective dialogs.
- Draw the polygon where you want to place your forest.
- Select Draw>Fill with Symbols from the menu bar.
- Click the Load button in the bottom-left of the dialog.
- Choose a forest fill, and then click Open.
- Click Run now
- Select the polygon you drew earlier, then right-click, and then select Do It from the pop-up menu.
If you want to create your own, custom forest fill (either from scratch or by modifying existing settings) here is a START. There's too much here for me to detail everything in this post.This is for the smooth polygon that you will fill with trees.
The exact sheet and layer may vary from map to map, so I'm not specifying them here, though the layer (not sheet) is typically VEGETATION.
The Forest Options dialog displays. It has a lot of fields and buttons so it may look intimidating, but "Keep Calm and Map On."
The Filler options dialog displays. It is a file browser window that opens to folder with various pre-set forest fills to choose from. (These are what the forest drawing tool loads via macro. Different map styles use different fills).
For example, for a mixed forest, select CC3_Mixed.FIL (You may not see the .FIL at the end of the file name, depending on your Windows settings). The dialog closes and loads the forest fill you selected.
The dialog closes and the cursor changes so you can select the polygon you want to fill.
The polygon should fill with your selected forest.
To set up a custom filled forest:
- Select Draw>Fill with Symbols from the menu bar.
- From here, you can load a pre-existing fill and then modify it or you can open a forest catalog and pick stuff from scratch. Do ONE of the following:
- [Optional if modifying, Required if creating] In the Symbol Name list (the ten, numbered text fields), click the ellipsis button next to the first field.
- [Optional if modifying, Required if creating] Pick a symbol from the catalog, and then click OK. You may just want to start with the first one.
- [Optional if modifying, Required if creating] Do the same for the remaining text boxes in the list, choosing a different symbol for each.
- Click the Help button to open the help topic on this dialog box. You will also definitely want to look at the link at the bottom of the help topic that opens the Creating "Fill with Symbols" settings help topic.
- Take another look at Ralf's post, above. Hopefully the "Unit size", CX, and CY stuff will make a little more sense now.
- Set up your fill the way you want and then click Save to save it for whenever you want to use it.
- As Monsen pointed out, above, you can click Run now to run it from the dialog. Note: If you do, be sure to have a polygon already drawn so you can select it when you run the fill.
Sorry I can't go into more detail; I've never done this myself, before just now. There's a lot to this command, but hopefully this can help get you started.The Forest Options dialog displays. Again, remember to "Keep Calm and Map On."
To Modify an Existing Fill- Click the Load button in the bottom-left of the dialog.
- Choose a forest fill, and then click Open.
- Click the Browse button near the top.
- Choose a forest catalog, and then click Open.
The Filler options dialog displays.
The dialog closes and loads the forest fill you selected.
OR
To Create a New Fill
The Symbol Catalog dialog displays.
The dialog closes and loads the forest catalog you selected into the Forest Options dialog box.
The Select Symbol dialog displays, showing all the symbols in the catalog you just opened.
The symbol name loads into that first text box in the list.
This is where I have to stop getting into detail, sorry. What follows now are general guidelines to help you figure the rest out.
Cheers,
~Dogtag
If some of the symbols somehow end up overlapping in the wrong order, you can select Symbols>Sort Symbols in Map from the menu bar. Select the symbols to correct, and then right-click and select Do It.
If, you are concerned about the scale of the trees after you place a forest, either with the macro-enabled tool, via the fill dialog, or by hand, you can select Symbols>Scale Symbols in Map to adjust the scale in one go. Just like the sort command, select the symbols to correct, and then right-click and select Do It. Keep in mind that it could cause issues with the layout since symbols are scaled in place.
Cheers,
~Dogtag
I apologize if my post was unclear. I've gone back and edited the steps to try and make it more clear.
I find that saving, closing CC3+ down, and then reopening cures this problem.
It might have nothing at all to do with what's happening to your forest tool, but then again... it could just as easily be related.
I have a comparable number of symbols to forests of symbol trees in my map, and this started happening a few days ago - once I was nearing half way to completion.
symbol catalog name. as i can guess, this is the location of the symbol catalog that it should. i used the custom one i made for doing woods. and for some reason it is not working. with the custom fill i made was a carbon copy of the mixed tree fill. and thats not what i wanted.
unit size. why dose it have a length and with size modifier?
offset. not to sure what this dose but i know it has to do with automatic placement. as i would like to have a small gap between symbols. giving this feel that the woods is not just row after roll of trees but it also has built in clearings and such.
symbol's count: not sure what exactly this dose.
symbol's name: now is this suppose be the name of the symbol being used in the catalog. which should be just tree then number. or is it to represents the base symbols.
cx and cy: i have no idea what these are.
also thank you for you patience with me. as i really want to get this to work. even thou it might crash the program. as right now i have over 15000 sprites on my map.
The now-I-can't-select-anything problem is typically due to a macro getting interrupted before it completes. Many macros save the current selection method, change it to something else so they can do their thing, and then restore it to the saved method. If something stops the macro before it can finish then the selection method you were using before is not restored. This has been addressed many times on the forum but Shessar, among others, provided a nice, succinct solution that, happily, does not require closing CC3.
what i am now ending up with is that while i can use the base fills. i cannot get the custom one to work. the symbol catalog i made was created by using 3 sets of pine and Decid trees. and 1 set of dead, deign and fruit trees. that i labeled tree 1 threw 30.
i changed the base name to tree 1 and up the count to 30. as their are 30 symbols in the mix. i changed the cx and cy to 1 and 30. as i believe that stands for the number of symbols in the catalog. and long story short. i whenever i use this fill nothing happens. any thought on why this is failing?
ps, i tried using help but the program is buged. it states i need to click on the image to learn more about each thing. but when i do it it just causes an script error.
The count can not go above 10, because you only have 10 "slots" in the list below. This is a limitation of the forest tool.
It looks like your forest is supposed to be very specific in its tree use (many different trees). This will not work well with the big forest parts (many trees in one symbol). May I suggest to not use a drawing tool for this, but place the symbols individually from the vegetation symbol catalog? You will have much better control and I suspect the results will be much better. Note that you can always properly order your symbols after placing them with the Symbols > Sort Symbols In Map command.
so saying i should just do it by hand is kinda not that helpful. thou you would think the program would have been able to handle something like this. as it is just the fill command with a larger verity of symbols.
First post, woo!
Hello all =)
But I did solve it temporarily by making grouped tree symbols. =D