Work In Progress: Kelleemah

So far, I have only been showing the part of my world that I have done a lot of work on.

Some of my friends on social media have asked how much the maps that I have done so far fill up the world of Kelleemah.

So I decided to post on the forum the full continent map of Kelleemah.

This is a work in progress that still requires a LOT of work still - ha, ha!

The area that I have filled so far with the regional maps that I have uploaded on the forum is outlined in red.

I am still working through the placement of all the islands so there is a lot of work still going into that.

This is the fourth time that this game world has been re-envisioned since the 1980's and with each one the world evolves and grows.

As such, I have taken a break and have been going back over what I have done so far and I am tweaking it a little here and there and adding place names and such.

As always, I would love your input, although this is still a project that is still in its early stages.


Thanks,


Charles W. Robinson

Comments

  • Wow! I've seen your detail maps and they are gorgeous.

    I wonder, if you are putting that level of detail on this size map, will you see massive slowdowns in time? Plus, I know that there are a maximum number of nodes a map can have before CC3 crashes. I don't know if there is a maximum number of objects that it can handle as well. Honestly, I have no idea, but you might want to find out before you go too far with this. That's going to be a lot of symbols!
  • Howdy,
    Very, very cool start to a large world map! Can't wait to see the progress!

    I'm finishing up my first 'real' map. It has taken a long time but was a labor of love and a learning experience. I plan on posting a link in the near future here in the forums.

    As for size/performance, a few numbers:
    - Using CC3+ v3.66, Mike Shley overland symbols
    - About 14,000 objects
    - 75+ layers, most with sheet effects, quite a few with multiple effects, bitmap fills, etc.
    - 1000mi x 800mi scale

    With effects on a full redraw takes around 18 seconds. I have a 6-core AMD FX-6100 with 12G of mem and an ASUS ATI HD7850 with 2G of mem. I do have options set to minimize unnecessary redraws but also high quality for bitmaps, etc. I do work with effects off and often hide sheets while working both for speed and for ease in selecting objects.

    I print tiled 3x3 with 2% overlap to produce 9 PNG files. This takes around 15+ minutes. Of course then I have to process/crop/assemble and align those 9 images and export to PNG ... and then post-process that a bit with Photoshop/GIMP/Paint.net. Painstaking process (at least for me, maybe I'm just slow) that takes 1 - 2 hours.

    Resulting final file is a 15,600px X 14,600px PNG (around 330MB) that is about 26" by 25" when printed.

    The map is so large I can't view it effectively on my monitor. And the monitor colors probably won't match the printed colors anyway. So printing it (at a place like OfficeDepot or the like) is an iterative process too.

    Save often :-) Save your sheet effects as named presets too. Save custom palettes. Make backups (on another machine/drive or via email of FCW file :-) CC3+ has performed very, very well for me throughout this process notwithstanding the redraw/print times. Only a few crashes. Very pleased with it!!!

    A long process but well worth it. I love CC3+ and have had a ball with it!

    Best of luck,
    -Mike
  • MonsenMonsen Administrator 🖼️ 46 images Cartographer
    @CharlesWayneRobinson: Are you really doing all your mapping on this one large map, and not using separate files for regional maps? If so, I'll have to advice you against continuing in this way. If you try filling up that map with symbols and entities at the scale you are mapping, you are going to run into limitations of both CC3(+) and the underlying operating system. You should REALLY consider mapping the world map as an overview map, and use individual regional maps to detail the areas of your map.
  • edited September 2015
    I have considered the issues presented above.

    I am not sure on what the limits are.

    I have thought of updating to a new computer with 32GB of Memory.

    In addition, I can make several versions of the world map with each having a target region done.

    Once I have the regions the way I want, I can then make a more general world map with the key terrain and locations on it.

    Since I am reinventing the game world for the 4rth time, I am working from the micro to macro as opposed to the more traditional macro to micro.

    I will essentially be using the basic world landmass and islands as a template so everything will match if I have to.

    From what I have read, trying to cut out sections of a large world and create a new regional map is a real pain in the posterior. Ha, ha!

    As an example, I may complete the region of Sutheimr and the surrounding regions and then save the file as Kelleemah Sutheimr.

    I then go back to my template map of Kellleemah and remove the work from Sutheimr except near the border regions and then start on an adjacent region.

    I can work my way through the regions this way.

    I may go ahead and do a Concept Map for Kelleemah though that is more abstract, just to show people what it will generally look like.

    But, I want the regional maps to eventually drive the overall look of Kelleemah.

    As far as printing is concerned, I have noticed a big difference in how my maps look on screen and how they look when printed.

    My printed versions look absolutely awesome compared to what I see on screen.

    My original goal was to produce a world map that will just fit onto my gaming table in the garage (5'x8' for both roll playing & table top war gaming).

    My test printing has produced great maps with excellent detail at this size & scale.

    I may have to relook at this since there seems to be some limitations and make a more general overview map.

    When I am starting to overload the program, what will be the symptoms that I will experience that will tell me that it is time to move onto another regional version of the map?

    Thanks for all the advise! :-)
  • MonsenMonsen Administrator 🖼️ 46 images Cartographer
    edited September 2015
    Posted By: CharlesWayneRobinsonI am not sure on what the limits are.
    Neither am I, but they are there. I know Windows itself starts getting into trouble if any entity consists of more than 10.000 nodes, which you may encounter if you try to fractalize the coastlines of the entire continent to get better detail when zoomed in.
    Posted By: CharlesWayneRobinsonI have thought of updating to a new computer with 32GB of Memory.
    CC3+ is a 32-bit program, so it will never be able to use more than 4GB (if Large Memory Aware is enabled, otherwise 2GB). 32GB is still usefull if you want to have lots of other software running at the same time obviously.
    Posted By: CharlesWayneRobinsonFrom what I have read, trying to cut out sections of a large world and create a new regional map is a real pain in the posterior
    I wouldn't say that. Once you learn and understand the process, it is rather quick. The majority of the work lies in populating your new cutout with the additional details the new zoom level requires.
    Posted By: CharlesWayneRobinsonWhen I am staring to overload the program, what will be the symptoms that I will experience that will tell me that it is time to move onto another regional version of the map?
    Slowdowns, crashes, inability to print/export, problems enabling effects due to the amount of calculations required, and in worst case, map corruption.
  • edited September 2015
    I have already fractalized the coast.

    It could use a little more work, but things start going weird for the large continent when I try going beyond what I have.

    Here, I have zoomed into the region around the Kraken's Den.

    I placed a city at the scale that I am using now to give an idea of the size area I am showing.

    The second one is zoomed in for the city and shows the level of fractilization compared to the scale.
  • The issue with nodes is going to be the number I have after I add all the islands.

    There are a lot of islands planned to still go onto the overall map.
  • When I started remapping Crestar, I made two huge maps, the northern and southern hemispheres. Now I'm making large 'basic' region maps with large rivers, country borders, bays, with maybe just the capital city marked, etc. Then smaller area maps with smaller rivers, hilly areas, etc. Then detail maps of an adventure area.

    No computer crashes this way.
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